Click Here
home features news forums classifieds faqs links search
6055 members 
Amiga Q&A /  Free for All /  Emulation /  Gaming / (Latest Posts)
Login

Nickname

Password

Lost Password?

Don't have an account yet?
Register now!

Support Amigaworld.net
Your support is needed and is appreciated as Amigaworld.net is primarily dependent upon the support of its users.
Donate

Menu
Main sections
Home
Features
News
Forums
Classifieds
Links
Downloads
Extras
OS4 Zone
IRC Network
AmigaWorld Radio
Newsfeed
Top Members
Amiga Dealers
Information
About Us
FAQs
Advertise
Polls
Terms of Service
Search

IRC Channel
Server: irc.amigaworld.net
Ports: 1024,5555, 6665-6669
SSL port: 6697
Channel: #Amigaworld
Channel Policy and Guidelines

Who's Online
25 crawler(s) on-line.
 24 guest(s) on-line.
 2 member(s) on-line.


 gonegahgah,  gdimauro

You are an anonymous user.
Register Now!
 gonegahgah:  17 secs ago
 gdimauro:  29 secs ago
 Hammer:  28 mins ago
 Sandpiper:  37 mins ago
 billt:  46 mins ago
 BigD:  1 hr 49 mins ago
 Karlos:  2 hrs 7 mins ago
 JKD:  2 hrs 17 mins ago
 Futaura:  3 hrs 21 mins ago
 saimon69:  3 hrs 23 mins ago

/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga Emulation
      /  Emulation: A passion
Register To Post

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 Next Page )
PosterThread
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 19-May-2014 22:02:24
#61 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@fishy_fis

After reading your post ...

I7 quadcore@2.3 ghz turbo bost 3ghz (2012 machine)
Qemu -no-kvm integer = 2.97
With kvm enabled little less performance of the real host (cpu)

G4 quad 2.5 ghz (2005 machine)
Qemu -no-kvm integer = 1.54
With kvm enabled little less performances of the real host cpu (Linux ppc)

This because virtualization use the CPU host be virtualized and virtualized is not emulated

If you wanna know your x86 performance start qemu as qemu-system-ppc64 -no-kvm and install a Linux ppc distro let us know of much bogomips your machine will gave to you.

On my g5 quad i can have with virtual pc four x 86 machine emulated and indipendend at a p3@700 performances at the same time ... It is a 2005 machine let us know what you will have with your :)

Ps: I forget on g5 I have shapeshaver with macos9 run really really fast! Try to understand why? ;)

If you need to know the quake performances on a G5 Quad you can check here :)


HERE IS BIGGER

a Small video

PS remember it is a 2005 machine :P :P

Last edited by tlosm on 19-May-2014 at 10:17 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 19-May-2014 at 10:15 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 19-May-2014 at 10:13 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 19-May-2014 at 10:13 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 19-May-2014 at 10:05 PM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Seiya 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 0:20:05
#62 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2006
Posts: 1442
From: Italia

@tlosm

however this screenshot don't show nothing..i don't see the numbers..i only see 3 fps with Cube 2...
If you want show benchmark of emulated/virtualized machine you should have to use 1 application, not 4 or 10 in same times..
This video and screenshot show that MacOS (like AROS) can handle various application at the same times..


however you say that you are able to emulate 4 x86 with virtual PC at 700 Mhz.
You can try and benchmark Winquake in any of this 4 session (in the same time) and then report the performance..
i'm curious here

Last edited by Seiya on 20-May-2014 at 12:20 AM.

_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
fishy_fis 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 4:24:52
#63 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2108
From: Australia

I cant really make direct comparisons unless using same software. Simply selecting the fastest option will mean Im using a virtualiser, which isnt a fair comparison. Even using same software doesnt really give results indicitive of performance of the host as code paths can be different in key areas (jit type emulation for eg.).

Using bochs, or qemu without accelerators are probably best like for like comparisons that can be made, but really comparing x86 guest speed isnt an equal playing field for x86 and ppc.

If a person wants/needs decent x86 performance though they'll just use a pc, or virtualization on a pc. Emulation, while a lot slower, still offers decent enough performance to have some fun, especially given its main use is retro.


Back to original question though, I use emulation regularly, from a dedicated amithlon system, through to having shedloads of emulators on my media centre. Recently Ive been buying a lot of 2nd hand ps2, gamecube and Wii games to use under emulation as theyre systems I never got int when they were new. Although I have a psp Ive also been using a psp emulator lately as my laptop screen is better sometimes and theres an appeal in playing some games on a big screen tv and joypad.

On a more amiga related note Ive been playing some daytona usa, scud racer ang virtua fighter 3 on SuperModel on AROS.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 20-May-2014 at 04:29 AM.
Last edited by fishy_fis on 20-May-2014 at 04:27 AM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 6:23:50
#64 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@Seiya
Ok I will do it in afternoon but run time demo of quake at same time it is impossible ... Because I have to switch window for do the command but will try :)
Note I don't use win quake but quake dos.
Note 2 virtualpc don't use video hardware acceleration of the host but is software gpu s3trio64


About the screenshot of games running
There are quake, quake2 , quake 3 and quake 4 plus cube2 running at the same time.. Note that 3fps are false because it become every time I don't have the window selected :)

you can check here is the same too.



bigger image

Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 07:40 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 06:31 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 06:29 AM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
KimmoK 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 7:39:22
#65 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@tlosm

Running 4 x86 environments @700Mhz P3 speeds sounds truly awesome! (different endianes and all)

(around y2000 I had 700Mhz Duron + Voodoo3 and it could playgames like need for speed porche unleashed in very high GFX quality, far better looking than PS2+GrandTourismo)

If also the 3D could be accelerated in emulation, you might have insanely cool x86 games environment on your G5 HW (IMHO).
(Perhaps using one thread to emulate the CPU and others the 3D.)

Do any emulator have wrapper to enable the use of native 3D library?

Last edited by KimmoK on 20-May-2014 at 07:40 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 8:13:53
#66 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@KimmoK

i know im try to find a wrapper for 3d gfx but the problem is the S3trio64 dont have a d3d video acceleration only direct drow 2d .
i had been installed some games found on my old twilight collection from 2000 to 2006 and the games who are using direct draw 2d are working really really good.
I will test Quake 2 who i know have sofware rendering but im pretty sure it will working good too.
I olready tested and are full playables with a no speed problems
Gorky 17
Unreal
Pro Quake and Quake (dos)
Homeworld
Alien vs Predator
Jagged Alliance 2
The Close combat serie
and some other 2d games .

About software not gaming right now i dont find nothing that dont work ... i will make a strange experiment ..
Virtual Box o Qemu inside the emulator and see what will happen.
Aros only dont run on VirtualPc but it is working on Qemu (slow) i will test it on Guest Pc.

Another big problem of VirtualPC and others that are limited to 512mb of ram :( only Qemu 2.0 is max 2047 (not 2048) memory limit ... I have 8 gb on my quad machine but this limit is very horrible if you think to use winxp (more ram is more better)
Plus we have to remember Virtual pc is not G5 optimized was only patched by microsoft for run on G5 but it will run more faster on a single G5 2.7 ghz compared with my Quad 2.5.. have a multi threading emulation can be the best choice for sure
but this emulator is deprecated in 2007 and no open sourced like alla microsoft things.

i see the difference about on Yabause (saturn emulator)
MacOsX single threading 42 max fps
LinuxPPC Debian Wheezy 7.5 PPC32 Multi Threading 120fps


About the 4xP3 emulators .
The G5 Quad is a real quadri core and every cpu are working as indipendents cpu if not compiled with last Xcode 3.1.2 for Osx 10.5.8

if the software is made with old Xcode the threads mooving from cpu0 to cpu3 after some cicles only kernel tasks stay fixed on cpu0.
This appen with Qemu 2.0 or with Dosbox or Virtualpc 7 means for have the 4 core used at 100% i have to open 4 emulator at same time with loose about the 10%/15% of the performances in all the emulated machines.
This is for games too or for every programs on macosx not made with last xcode and G5 optimized

check here cpus overall used as 95.47% (as write %utente) 95.47%=4 cores

Big image

check here cpus overall used as 25% (as write %utente) 25%=1 core

Big image

In the photos is qemu but Virtual pc is the same


From all the software made right now only 4 or 5 programs are working using the quad core at same time this are:
Last i life 09 (ppc)
Logic Studio
Final Cut pro
Leopard webkit
Teen Four Fox G5
(i dont have been tested shapeshaver but im pretty sure it work using all the 4 core at same time i will report)

Im testing Linux Lubuntu ppc64 and there the os and all is running at 64 bit speed i can say the difference with OSx 10.5.8 are really impressive.
The only worst is Lubuntu is Vsync and i cant run a quake time demo for know how much is the speed .. :(


Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 10:11 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 10:11 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 10:07 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 08:30 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 08:27 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 08:23 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 08:20 AM.
Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 08:15 AM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 10:34:12
#67 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

for understand a little bit the performances
this is softwindows 95 on a cube G4 (450mhz)
Immagine on Quad core G5 2.5 ghz :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9-m73_rYuY

This is on a 200mhz 604e
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YynA-aM0qw


Soon i will made my own video ;)

Last edited by tlosm on 20-May-2014 at 11:14 AM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 17:50:47
#68 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@tlosm

worst thing :( virtual pc made me open only on one core,i can open eg. 10 virtual pc but all are using only one of the 4 core of G5 ... qemu not.
I can make the test for example open Virtual PC and try to run another on Shapeshaver or will try with RealPC (is more slower compared with virtual pc but can work)

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
pavlor 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 17:57:13
#69 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9476
From: Unknown

@tlosm

Quote:
worst thing :( virtual pc made me open only on one core,i can open eg. 10 virtual pc but all are using only one of the 4 core of G5 ... qemu not.


If your applications need mostly single core performance (eg. older games), support for more (slow - like in QEMU) cores is not needed.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 20-May-2014 18:16:52
#70 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@pavlor

yes i know but i become really curious use 4 virtual pc one for every core :(
this make understand how much buggy and not optimized is this emulator... like usual if microsoft didnt buy insinia probably today will be a better pc emulator for this machine :(

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 22-May-2014 19:43:48
#71 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@tlosm

Here is the Quad G5 Emulating something 8)

Sorry this is the video un cut (director cut :P) im uploading a better one .
Note watch all ;)
Quad G5 2.5ghz emulating :P

Last edited by tlosm on 22-May-2014 at 10:57 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 22-May-2014 at 10:54 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 22-May-2014 at 07:47 PM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Seiya 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 22-May-2014 20:04:03
#72 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2006
Posts: 1442
From: Italia

@tlosm

Quad G5 is a monster in power :)

Last edited by Seiya on 22-May-2014 at 08:05 PM.

_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 22-May-2014 22:55:32
#73 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@Seiya

yesss and all in the video games are in software rendering MacOs 9 too .

Last edited by tlosm on 22-May-2014 at 10:56 PM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Seiya 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 22-May-2014 23:32:24
#74 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2006
Posts: 1442
From: Italia

@tlosm

does virtualpc support any 3D acceleration?

edit:
i think that i know already the answer because if it have to emulate x86 maybe it cannot emulate also the GPU..

Last edited by Seiya on 22-May-2014 at 11:35 PM.
Last edited by Seiya on 22-May-2014 at 11:33 PM.
Last edited by Seiya on 22-May-2014 at 11:33 PM.

_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
TheDungeonDelver 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 22-May-2014 23:52:50
#75 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 17-Apr-2004
Posts: 815
From: Unknown

Quote:

does virtualpc support any 3D acceleration?

edit:
i think that i know already the answer because if it have to emulate x86 maybe it cannot emulate also the GPU..


Old, old versions did (back when VPC was a Connectix product). On the Mac there was 3dfx emulation.

I suppose you could try something sneaky with a GLide wrapper, as people have done on DOSBox (running Win'98) on the PC.

_________________
The problem with AmigaOS on PPC isn't that PPC is big-endian. The problem with AmigaOS on PPC is that PPC is dead-endian.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
fishy_fis 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 23-May-2014 1:40:50
#76 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2108
From: Australia

Not too shabby. In some areas g5 seems comparable to 10 year old pcs, which is quite usable.Quake 2 there almost looks 1/4 as fast as it does running on a emulated 68k cpu on my core2duo amithlon box (a bit over 300fps).
Ive just learned that there's some 68k mac emus of x86, so Im gonna try emulating a pc, on emulated mac on emulated. 68k cpu.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tommywright 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 23-May-2014 1:56:54
#77 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Jan-2010
Posts: 359
From: Asheville, NC

I bought a Chromebook recently.. it's an Acer c720 with 4gigs of RAM. I swapped the 16 gig HD for 128 to give me some breathing room. I installed Crouton to get both Chrome and Ubuntu Linux running and what I'm amazed at is how well it emulates an Amiga with FS-UAE under Linux. It's actually the best I've seen yet! It's odd because my netbook was far too slow and my big gaming computer was great but even it had some issues here and there.

On the Chromebook, I've run everything I can find from demos to games and I haven't seen any issues like skipping audio or layer drawing problems that I have seen with my other machines. Is the Chomebook the ultimate Amiga emulator?

The only issue I ran into was on It Came from the Desert when I went to the hospital... suddenly my joystick stopped working. I only played it once and maybe I bumped the usb or something. I love trying to escape the hospital!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
fishy_fis 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 23-May-2014 3:32:20
#78 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2108
From: Australia

@tommywright

Perhaps a config. issue? FS-UAE is slower than winuae, and chromebooks are pretty weak also.
Even on my old, freebie athlon64 x2 laptop it works nicely, let alone my 3x as fast i5 laptopl and twice as fast again i7 desktop. Simply put the setup you mentioned should be beaten silly by anyhing resembling a modern machine for UAE.


Edit: ah, I just noticed, linux? Perhaps that's the issue rather than raw grunt. FS-UAE would be an advantage there given the gl rendering helps with linuxes more modest 2d rendering options.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 23-May-2014 at 04:24 AM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 25-May-2014 15:43:43
#79 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2735
From: Amiga land

@TheDungeonDelver

old connectix realpc was not a 3dfx emulation but was using direct the 3dfx if the board was inside the old macs.pratically the board was reserved by the emulation was native and was really speedy.

i will try to find a wrapper but i think the dosbox was using glide->sdl for use the video board 3d acceleration ... in any way is good to know for use it in dosbox for macos and amigaos too:)


@fishy_ns
quake 2 was running native in shapeshaver ad this is a virtualized cpu.
i can run the game in software rendering at 1080p withou frames droped down.

@all
if i run only virtual pc alone i can run unreal in software rendering at 1024x768 and it will run like the video i make .

if i run euaejit alone i have 98mips and not 73 like in the video (note euae jit is not really optimized for g5 cpu)

windows 95 in shapeshaver in macos9 windows boot in 2 seconds ;)
i had realpc someware i will test it too.
the shapeshaver build is 2009 the last 2014 is really unstable.

the best macos 9 emulation is the apple classic system in tiger but apple like usual do a shit dropping down it in leopard and tiger gave a great core panic on g5 quad... apple you are the best of the worst

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
fishy_fis 
Re: Emulation: A passion
Posted on 26-May-2014 3:30:13
#80 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2108
From: Australia

Dosbox 3dfx emulation is cpu emulated, it doesnt give access to the hosts 3d subsystem. Additionally it requires a custom build with diffs applied against 0.72. As far as I know my AROS version is the only amiga-oid system to support it. PPC is probably too weak to get any useful speed from it anyway.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 26-May-2014 at 03:35 AM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 Next Page )

[ home ][ about us ][ privacy ] [ forums ][ classifieds ] [ links ][ news archive ] [ link to us ][ user account ]
Copyright (C) 2000 - 2019 Amigaworld.net.
Amigaworld.net was originally founded by David Doyle