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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
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blizz1220 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 10:56:33
#261 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Errr ... criminal act , stealing car yes , but stealing code in
most countries isn't considered to be.You have criminal law
and civil law and copyright would usually go with civil law
protection.

If it was criminal act then the person who used others code
would go to jail but you couldn't ask it for money , you would
have to start civil case for that.

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cdimauro 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 10:56:34
#262 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 2096
From: Germany

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
That wasn't a mistake, but an intentional, criminal, act.


I see your mind reading techniques are really good. If AmigaOS developers say it was mistake, I have no reason not to trust them, same for MorphOS Team etc.

The subsequent "fix" proves the contrary...

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cdimauro 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 10:57:47
#263 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 2096
From: Germany

@blizz1220

Quote:

blizz1220 wrote:
@cdimauro

Errr ... criminal act , stealing car yes , but stealing code in
most countries isn't considered to be.You have criminal law
and civil law and copyright would usually go with civil law
protection.

If it was criminal act then the person who used others code
would go to jail but you couldn't ask it for money , you would
have to start civil case for that.

Of course, it depends by the specific law. Copyright in EU contries has similar laws.

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pavlor 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 11:06:25
#264 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9114
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
The subsequent "fix" proves the contrary...


I don´t share your "logic". It proves they made mistake and corrected it. It only depends on point of view...

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blizz1220 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 11:06:26
#265 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Well they should be pretty much the same regarding
most of them are based on Civil Codex.Other difference is that
you in most cases start trial in criminal court by contacting police
or public prosecutor.

Other difference is that criminal acts are all named and defined
in criminal law so anything that isn't there isn't criminal act.

Last edited by blizz1220 on 19-Sep-2015 at 11:06 AM.

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Massi 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 12:36:10
#266 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 519
From: Rome, Italy

@cdimauro

Quote:
You cannot come here saying: "I didn' t go through all posts." making some "guesses" trying to rewrite what happened an was already greatly discussed.


And why not, because you, the anti OS4/Hyperion/ACube/and so on, decided so???

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cdimauro 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 14:48:11
#267 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 2096
From: Germany

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
The subsequent "fix" proves the contrary...


I don´t share your "logic". It proves they made mistake and corrected it. It only depends on point of view...

They FIRST copied it. Then, AFTER that Piru published his complaints, they copied AGAIN the same files rephrasing something, which WORSEN the things.

Those are the FACTs, and that's not a point of view. No, it wasn't a mistake, but a deliberate action.


@blizz1220

Quote:

blizz1220 wrote:
@cdimauro

Well they should be pretty much the same regarding
most of them are based on Civil Codex.Other difference is that
you in most cases start trial in criminal court by contacting police
or public prosecutor.

Other difference is that criminal acts are all named and defined
in criminal law so anything that isn't there isn't criminal act.

Yes, but plus or minus they apply the same principles.


@Massi

Quote:

Massi wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
You cannot come here saying: "I didn' t go through all posts." making some "guesses" trying to rewrite what happened an was already greatly discussed.


And why not,

Then go read the thread first, which should be the bare minimum requirement for a user which frequents a forum.

Quote:
because you, the anti OS4/Hyperion/ACube/and so on, decided so???

That's the usual "Ad hominem" attack: a logical fallacy which is common for people which weren't able to rebut to something.

What I've expressed doesn't change if the guilty was the MorphOS or AROS team. The fact that I've chosen the latter doesn't mean that I hate Hyperion, or even the MorphOS team. It's simply a choice of an hobby o.s. of the post-Amiga land. And that's definitely nothing that can fire sentiments like love, hate, etc. That's all.

Now, if there's something wrong about what I, and other people (read: I wasn't alone to sustain certain things) have written, you're free to show it.

Or quit the thread, since you aren't giving any concrete contribute, failing AGAIN to a personal attack, like the many that you did in the past, and for whom you also got suspended.

There's no medical prescription that obey you to read, or even reply to, my posts: live and let me live. Thanks.

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Massi 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 15:00:23
#268 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 519
From: Rome, Italy

@cdimauro

Quote:
Or quit the thread, since you aren't giving any concrete contribute


Only you give contributions to threads ...

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broadblues 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 15:25:31
#269 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4411
From: Portsmouth England

@cdimauro

Quote:

They FIRST copied it.


They? Who is they? This isn't a monolithic situation, one person coppied the material, I'm guessing as part of teh same "time saving action" (yet still incorrect ofcourse) as the MUI4.

Another person later included that contant in the SDK in error. An apology was issued and the documents replaced. (might have been the other way round time wise, it gets confusing...)

Quote:

Then, AFTER that Piru published his complaints, they copied AGAIN the same files rephrasing something, which WORSEN the things.


Whether they coppied or rewrote is your opionion you have no evidenec on that, and whther worsened the situatin is also your opinion.

Quote:

Those are the FACTs, and that's not a point of view.


Only your fisrt FACT is a fact, all the rest of that is your opinion.

Quote:

No, it wasn't a mistake, but a deliberate action.


Including it in the SDK was mistake, ( I belive at any rate), copying was deliberate, though deliberate doesn't mean 'evil', rather misplaced expediency, the correct thng would have been to ask and credit.

Quote:

That's the usual "Ad hominem" attack: a logical fallacy which is common for people which weren't able to rebut to something.


Enough with the logical fallicies already, you uses them so much in your arguments, you are guilty of the fallicy fallicy !

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broadblues 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 15:29:36
#270 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4411
From: Portsmouth England

@Massi

Quote:

And why not, because you, the anti OS4/Hyperion/ACube/and so on, decided so???


No because it would have been polite to make some effort to be aware of what had been discussed, not just butt in with some random unfounded generalisation, that makes it okay, "oh everybody does it" to type thing.

It wasn't okay, but it has been rectified, even if not to everyones full satisfation (not sure that would ever be possible).

Quote:

Only you give contributions to threads ...


What are you, a three year old?

cdmaurios style of discussion can be annoying from time to tinme, but yours is worse by far, please grow up!

Last edited by broadblues on 19-Sep-2015 at 03:30 PM.

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Massi 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 15:38:24
#271 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 519
From: Rome, Italy

@broadblues

I had stated before that I didn' t have the time to read all the posts ... please read it again (post #230).
And I expressed my general opinion, not related to this OS4 case, so what?

Last edited by Massi on 19-Sep-2015 at 03:40 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 15:55:51
#272 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9114
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
Those are the FACTs, and that's not a point of view.


Oh no not again... we had pretty long discussion about such your "facts".


In any case, error (you call it crime ) was corrected and even MorphOS SDK was updated to reflect contributions from AROS. Good outcome, I think.

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itix 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 16:20:47
#273 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

Not problem in MorphOS SDK or MorphOS ISO. Three keymap source codes (http://www.morphos-team.net/files/src/3.9/keymaps.tar.bz2) found at downloads page dont have AROS copyrights.

I agree, it is sometimes good to have discussions like this.

Last edited by itix on 19-Sep-2015 at 04:26 PM.
Last edited by itix on 19-Sep-2015 at 04:23 PM.

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Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

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Signal 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 16:21:23
#274 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2013
Posts: 664
From: USA

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
In any case, error (you call it crime ) was corrected and even MorphOS SDK was updated to reflect contributions from AROS. Good outcome, I think.


Error, mistake, oversight.........etc.

In order for a criminal act to take place, there has to be criminal intent.

When Intel purposely modified the compiler to make AMDs chips use software to do math instead of the math unit that was intent. And they paid dearly for it.

There was no intent here. The copyright was not replaced with another, the person working on the files forgot to re-include the notice before submitting it to the SDK. Problem pointed out, problem fixed. Sheeesh!

_________________
Tinkering with computers.

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pavlor 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 16:27:24
#275 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9114
From: Unknown

@Signal

Quote:
In order for a criminal act to take place, there has to be criminal intent.


Not in all jurisdictions. However, topic of this thread certainly is not subject for meaningful "criminal case".

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Massi 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 16:29:04
#276 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 519
From: Rome, Italy

@Signal

Quote:
When Intel purposely modified the compiler to make AMDs chips use software to do math instead of the math unit that was intent. And they paid dearly for it.


Good example, thanks.

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SAM440EP-FLEX @ 733 Mhz, AmigaOS 4.1 Update 1

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recedent 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 18:01:45
#277 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Jan-2010
Posts: 225
From: Tarnów

@Signal

Quote:
The copyright was not replaced with another, the person working on the files forgot to re-include the notice before submitting it to the SDK. Problem pointed out, problem fixed.


AFAIR the're was no "fix". The "fix" as I see it would be adding the (previously deleted) Piru's copyright notice to the files. Not altering them a little so that proving the infrigement would be a little harder.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 19:54:31
#278 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11384
From: Norway

@recedent

That or removing the files completely, copyrights should be respected. It is like if you buy a film, then change copyrights, and then it is okay to distribute it?

Personally I think this is a waste of time debating, we should need to debate it at all, but on the other hand I feel like Morph developers are fishing, how did the source code get compiled and end up in OS4 SDK? Don't MorphOS developers have a private repository?

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 20-Sep-2015 at 11:23 AM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 19-Sep-2015 at 09:03 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 20:07:44
#279 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9114
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Header files are public in MorphOS SDK.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Copyright Infringement in OS4 SDK
Posted on 19-Sep-2015 21:02:10
#280 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11384
From: Norway

@pavlor

Yes but the library is not, so where did it come from?
Can't use MorphOS version, as only a JMP table not a interface table.

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