Click Here
home features news forums classifieds faqs links search
5769 members 
Amiga Q&A /  Free for All /  Emulation /  Gaming / (Latest Posts)
Login

Nickname

Password

Lost Password?

Don't have an account yet?
Register now!

Support Amigaworld.net
Your support is needed and is appreciated as Amigaworld.net is primarily dependent upon the support of its users.
Donate

Menu
Main sections
Home
Features
News
Forums
Classifieds
Links
Downloads
Extras
OS4 Zone
IRC Network
AmigaWorld Radio
Newsfeed
Top Members
Amiga Dealers
Information
About Us
FAQs
Advertise
Polls
Terms of Service
Search

IRC Channel
Server: irc.amigaworld.net
Ports: 1024,5555, 6665-6669
SSL port: 6697
Channel: #Amigaworld
Channel Policy and Guidelines

Who's Online
51 crawler(s) on-line.
 15 guest(s) on-line.
 0 member(s) on-line.



You are an anonymous user.
Register Now!
 outlawal2:  27 mins ago
 towo2099:  34 mins ago
 DiscreetFX:  35 mins ago
 Rob:  43 mins ago
 MichaelMerkel:  49 mins ago
 BSzili:  51 mins ago
 kamelito:  1 hr 5 mins ago
 billt:  1 hr 6 mins ago
 Vidar:  1 hr 11 mins ago
 1Mouse:  1 hr 13 mins ago

/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga OS4 Hardware
      /  Tabor/X5000
Register To Post

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 Next Page )
PosterThread
BigD 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 4-Oct-2019 21:16:01
#101 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5108
From: UK

@number6

Quote:
Have you considered the possibility that the "expected" content was missing?


No, I would have expected someone to have pointed it out before now if there was no statement from Trevor.

I can only assume it was a synopsis about sound drivers, reassurances regarding the uncertainty about using the AmigaOne brand name and a bold statement about it being worth the wait "when it's done"!

Last edited by BigD on 04-Oct-2019 at 09:22 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 04-Oct-2019 at 09:21 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Spectre660 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 17:13:48
#102 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Jun-2005
Posts: 3771
From: Unknown

@K-L

I am back to Aeon Beta testing duties.
Breathing and smiling broadly with good reason .


Quote:

K-L wrote:
@BigD

No. P5020 can barely cope with 720p (X1000 does even better thanks to AltiVec) so don't hold your breath.

_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
K-L 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 17:23:57
#103 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2006
Posts: 1344
From: Oullins, France

@Spectre660

Ok, so let's hold our breath

_________________
AmigaONE X1000, 2GB, Sapphire Radeon HD 7700
Webmaster of Amiga-NG.org (French)

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Skateman 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 18:15:46
#104 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2017
Posts: 99
From: Netherlands

@Spectre660

Welcome back Spectre.... been a while!

_________________
AmigaOne X5000 -> 2GHz / 16GB RAM / Radeon R7 250 / M-Audio 5.1 -> AmigaOS 4.1 FE / Ubuntu Linux
Amiga 1200 -> Recapped / 68ec020 ACA 1221ec / CF HDD / RetroNET connected to the world

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
outrun1978 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 18:59:25
#105 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 22-Feb-2015
Posts: 564
From: Unknown

@Spectre660

Indeed welcome back, Its been a poorer place around these parts without your valuable support.

_________________
Amigaone X5000/20 4GB Radeon RX 550 Polaris 12 AmigaOS4.1 Final Edition Update 1
Amiga 1200 Workbench 3.1.4
Amiga CD32

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Spectre660 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 20:39:39
#106 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Jun-2005
Posts: 3771
From: Unknown

@Skateman & Outrun1978

Thanks Guys.
Good to be back.

Some extremely interesting stuff woke me out of my slumber .


_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Skateman 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 9-Nov-2019 20:55:38
#107 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2017
Posts: 99
From: Netherlands

@Spectre660

I Wonder.......

_________________
AmigaOne X5000 -> 2GHz / 16GB RAM / Radeon R7 250 / M-Audio 5.1 -> AmigaOS 4.1 FE / Ubuntu Linux
Amiga 1200 -> Recapped / 68ec020 ACA 1221ec / CF HDD / RetroNET connected to the world

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
drawn 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 22-Nov-2019 7:00:39
#108 ]
New Member
Joined: 30-Jul-2009
Posts: 2
From: Unknown

@SACC-dude

Nice to read your reply and I see you own an X5000, a beautiful and powerful system. I gather you have a booth @ AmiWest? I missed the October show, perhaps next year. Good luck.



Drawn.

Last edited by drawn on 22-Nov-2019 at 07:04 AM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
asymetrix 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 26-Nov-2019 5:11:37
#109 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 847
From: United Kingdom

@OlafS25

Quote:

relied (regarding hardware) on advices of others ...


I remember Apple had the same problem with their 68k system, the 68k processor was made to do everything - slowed it down.

Whereas the Commodore engineers knew the processors limits and added extra chips/DSPs etc to assist in hardware acceleration in all areas, these engineers cared.

I call it the Amiga spirit - the spirit to do the best & most efficient one can - professionals.

Last edited by asymetrix on 26-Nov-2019 at 05:13 AM.
Last edited by asymetrix on 26-Nov-2019 at 05:12 AM.

_________________
Download 499.26 Mbps, 659.94 Mbps Upload :)

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OlafS25 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 26-Nov-2019 10:20:45
#110 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5668
From: Unknown

@asymetrix

the problem is not that you have to rely on professionals but that you rely on professionals who have no clue of the product

Varisys obviously has designs ready and they sold that to Aeon, but Varisys obviously has no clue of amiga. The hardware works with linux but the hardware is not for linux but for amigaos. As I understand it at the start aeon asked hyperion if the hardware is ok but the responsible persons at hyperion did not look carefully on it because they were busy and answered "propably" or something like that. Aeon interpreted that as "yes" and let Varisys do the hardware. When the persons at hyperion looked at the hardware they saw the problems and asked for redesign (expecially regarding the wrong processor choice) Trevor said no. Also it seems there never was a communication between hyperion, aeon and varisys regarding driver development. Varisys did the hardware and hyperion has to do what they can to get something running on it. A suboptimal way to manage a project I would say.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Kronos 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 26-Nov-2019 12:19:42
#111 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2204
From: Unknown

@asymetrix

You would have a point if the Aniga had been designed around an old CPU or something broken by design (8086).

But no they choose a CPU that was super modern for the time and than added the chips as an extra bonus.

Something that became a problem when it moved byond a basic 68000.

_________________
- We don't need good ideas, we haven't run out on bad ones yet
- blame Canada

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Hypex 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 26-Nov-2019 14:26:55
#112 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9725
From: Greensborough, Australia

@OlafS25

Quote:
When the persons at hyperion looked at the hardware they saw the problems and asked for redesign (expecially regarding the wrong processor choice) Trevor said no.


What was wrong with the processor? It was a PowerPC?

It would seem to be a fine CPU of choice in the X1000 apart from the kernel acting somewhat unstable that other CPUs don't have problems with.

But wait, the Tabor and X5000? The Tabor yeah, I wouldn't have picked that CPU. Lacking AltiVec is one thing, but lacking an FPU with SPE in place? Nah, that should have been a deal breaker, it's a money pit.

Good intentions,, bad luck.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OlafS25 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 26-Nov-2019 14:31:51
#113 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5668
From: Unknown

@Hypex

I wrote about Tabor and its CPU

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
tlosm 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 27-Nov-2019 6:30:04
#114 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2683
From: Amiga land

@OlafS25

for my point of view:
tabor cpu was a bad choice ... something that was to much different compared the last 20y ppc amigaos cpu, and no so powerful to emulate the last gen aone fpu.
the x5000 isnt the best hw, the x1000 is the last best one. what amigans friend dont want to understand is .. the machine cores are too little for the today performances they start sweet hard just with browsing internet... and more the years are going more the brwowsing will be hard.

i have my quad g5 with debian 10 PPC64 installed .. the machine is very fast and rensponsive compared the past linux distros and compared macosx leopard too ... firefox now is multi threading and with egl acceleration enabled (wrong colors but work) result the internet browsing performances are much much bed compared a vorke mini pc with celeron j3455 cpu and intelhd.
some one will write it is normal x64 have jit have asm script ... i know, but not fan boys like we are will say that for they performances are important and not only have a boing ball on the os desk.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
bennymee 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 27-Nov-2019 13:02:14
#115 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2003
Posts: 576
From: Netherlands

@tlosm

The cpu was not the best one, but problaby requered a less layered board to be cheaper.

But the announcement of the Tabor was allready 4 years ago. And if even the sound and network driver are allready a showstopper, we should not even dream about anything with a better cpu afterall.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
KimmoK 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 28-Nov-2019 8:15:10
#116 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5187
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@tabor's cpu

IIRC, P1022 was more readily available than T1022, therefore it was selected.
(and, IIRC, P1022 has i2s for audio, while T1022 does not have that)

(There was a $200 design around P1022 at power.org at some point, but it never got into production.
That would have been a very interesting alternative/option for low end AOS4 device.)

The main disadvantage of P1022 was/is that it needs special attention to build SW for it, because of the incompatible FPU. (but that feels pretty "at home" because we've already used to cyberpatcher etc. already in 060 era, the advantage now is that OS is being develped so, no "patch" needed, even though SW optimization needed to get maximum out of the CPU)

Secondary disadvantage is that it prevents AOS evolution to 64bit ... but in real life we may not have R&D resources for 64bit anyways in near future.

IMhO: I find tabor/A1222 interesting because it is anyway a lot cheaper than x5000 and anyway a lot more powerfull than my current SAM440ep. (and A1222 can at least use more RAM & multicore, once SW support is built) P1022 and P50x0 are good enough untill PowerPC production ends (or some other affordable Power clone pop's up).

A little related, "minimum" availability of the chips:
P1020 launched 2008 available -> 2023
P5020 launched 2010 available -> 2020
P5040 launched 2012 available -> 2022
T208x launched 2012 available -> 2027

-> around 2024, the production should be using T series and perhaps Power for high-end
-> current roadmaps indicate that ISA change need to appear around 2028 unless Open Power start to deliver affordable continuation

Last edited by KimmoK on 28-Nov-2019 at 11:37 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 28-Nov-2019 at 11:37 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
geen_naam 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 4-Jan-2020 18:53:57
#117 ]
New Member
Joined: 29-Nov-2003
Posts: 9
From: Unknown

Hello,

I have been away for several years. But now I am thinking of buying a next generation machine. Tabor doesn't seem sensible to me. Not very powerful and the need for FPU emulation. So I am looking at the X5000. But I just found out that the processor is end of life. So this doesn't make much sense for me either. Or am I missing something?
Is there multi-core support for the X5000 anyways?



 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 4-Jan-2020 20:41:54
#118 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11209
From: Norway

@geen_naam

End of life means nothing here really, sure its can be issue with warranty if cant get the CPU replaced if it breaks, but Im sure there be stocks of CPU's some where in some place, new old stock stuff, stuff just waiting to get used.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Jan-2020 at 08:43 PM.

_________________
Please check out my software:
Excalibur, Basilisk 2, AmigaInputAnywhere.
LiveForIt-Music
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OneTimer1 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 4-Jan-2020 23:36:07
#119 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 535
From: Unknown

@KimmoK

Quote:



The main disadvantage of P1022 was/is that it needs special attention to build SW for it, because of the incompatible FPU. (but that feels pretty "at home" because we've already used to cyberpatcher etc.


Back in the 68000 Era the CPU did not have a FPU.

Floating Point Operations where done via built in libraries, developers could always relay on this libraries in AOS3. If an FPU was present in the system this libraries used them, so even software without FPU optimisation got the benefits of a FPU.

On AOS4 they started with a PPC that had a built in FPU and they never made developers using some libraries, now they introduced a PPC without compatible FPU and they are running into troubles.

That's when weak OS design meats weak hardware design.




 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
khayoz 
Re: Tabor/X5000
Posted on 5-Jan-2020 1:24:43
#120 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 26-Dec-2004
Posts: 177
From: Stockholm, Sweden

@geen_naam

Hello and welcome back!

"CPU is EOL", no worries the CPU is soldered on the motherboard, aint going nowhere ;)

I have owned a X5000 since december 2016 and use it as my daily computer and
Im very happy with it, if I miss some app or something doesn't work I use a macbook
but that isn't happening much.


If you have the cash go for it, your'e not gonna regret it!
Or dip your toes into the Tabor/A1222 and try it out,
you can always sell it here or on Amibay and upgrade later.

No multicore support as of yet, but work is happening in the shadows. ;)
Can't find the video now but search youtube - "Amiwest 2019 Steven Solie"

Acill made a nice X5000 review the other day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvmYhBe23II





Last edited by khayoz on 05-Jan-2020 at 01:26 AM.

_________________

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 Next Page )

[ home ][ about us ][ privacy ] [ forums ][ classifieds ] [ links ][ news archive ] [ link to us ][ user account ]
Copyright (C) 2000 - 2019 Amigaworld.net.
Amigaworld.net was originally founded by David Doyle