@Spectre660

Quote:

The AmigaOS 4.1 revenue model is one of the problems. You need money for continued development.

You'd have more money/customers if more hardware/OS4 licenses were sold. Now, I'd be interested to find just how much OS 4.1 Classics have been bought to run in emulation, would be interesting to know and compare to HW sold during the same time.

There's one other issue at play here. Staying on PPC is one thing, but staying on big endian PPC? IBM is pushing little endian for cross platform development, RISC-V, ARM, x86_64 are all little endian.

_________________

@Thread

A-EON just need to get a roadmap/sales strategy in place regarding the Tabor with firm release dates, some press release, marketing, bundles, confirmation of case and peripherals included etc and we’ll see whether it’ “time to move on”!

Why people here think that the Tabor will be supported despite a fumbled underwhelming launch is beyond me It could still be a success but not with this apathetic “Covid spoilt our party” kind of attitude and a lack of clarity on when the hard mainstream launch is beyond the Early Adopter 1.1/2 year wait debacle with the shiny shoe box but no ‘shoes’

Last edited by BigD on 18-Dec-2020 at 09:26 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

The wait is not a debacle.
Manufacturing a production run of boards without being sure that the audio would work might have been though.

Last edited by Spectre660 on 18-Dec-2020 at 08:04 PM.

_________________
Sam460ex : Radeon Rx550 Single slot Video Card : SIL3112 SATA card

@BigD

Assuming its the price that was the problem, assuming that the A1222 bring price down to an acceptable range. I think there is skeptical about FPU, and what people like to know how It will affect software, will there be issues, bugs, problems related to not having a normal FPU, and what is impact of that.

If it turns out it was just a storm in a waterglass, the sales might pickup, if turns out this was major problem, like fearmongers are saying then, it most likely won’t be success.

Anyway AmigaONE range of machines are target at productivity (art and paint programs, software devlopment), and the gaming is coming, but it not classic gaming experience, the AmigaONE product might lot more attractive if is supported Paula / Timing and Blitter, Paula / Denice / CIAA/B chips. These things are figured out using FPGA’s.

lowend Amiga systems are getting faster, RP4 is round emulation is as fast Pentium 90Mhz, the Warp060 / Vampire range accelerators is range of 100-200 Mhz, a lot people will be happy with this systems, and they do provide more unique retro Amiga experience.

In my humble option AmigaONE be more attractive if they blended better with classic Amiga range.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Dec-2020 at 09:16 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Dec-2020 at 08:47 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Dec-2020 at 08:44 PM.

_________________
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/
Facebook::LiveForIt Software for AmigaOS

@Everblue

Quote:

@Spectre660 I have nothing "against" PPC. It is just that the price/power ratio makes no sense in 2020(1). I would love to be proven wrong of course!

Damn.

When was it about the price/power, since 1994???

_________________
Amiga 1200 + WARP 1260 + AmigaOS 3.2

@Everblue

Quote:

Well, I don't know, but my guess is that developing expensive boards (which have problems selling out after a number of years) is not an insignificant effort.

I don't know how many of the original production of X5000 boards are left but I suspect the are no longer stacked floor to ceiling. It's worth bearing in mind that the photo linked was taken in January 2017 and the X5000 went on sale in October 2016 and it was at least a few months before you could get any from the Eurpean dealers.

Quote:

Can't this money be used to hire developers to bring the OS to less niche hardware so the entire effort becomes more viable in terms of hardware and investment requirements by the consumer? I mean, what's the point for Amiga OS to keep digging its own hole?

Sure it could but it means the whole OS needs to be ported to the new architecture rather than just adapting the kernel and writing some new drivers and at this stage if they went on to produce new E5500 and E6500 based hardware then porting work would be fairly minimal. With a new architecture you would also lose a lot of software that won't be backported from PPC and I think the biggest problem facing the NG OSs is the lack of new and especially unique software.

IMHO about Tabor A1222 I’m quite confident, once implemented SMP by ExecSG team, speed will not be a big issue due dual core@1200MHz implemented, derivate from e500 ppc class.
Even the fpu emulation will not be an issue, if it will be implemented and will be perfectly compatible.
For native spe code instead you should gain more speed over classic fpu.
The key will be the presence of new software developed or recompiled ad hoc for Tabor.
Maybe a viable way could be introduce for Amiga OS4.x universal binaries, just like apple did, selecting code at runtime between different supported cpu classes.
I think could be introduced tree different cpu types, plain ppc, AltiVec ppc and spe ppc.

Even ddr3 support was a great choice, while expansion could be archived using pcie riser card up to max 3 slots.

Project is very interesting still now, anyway endprice, time to market, lack of drivers and Linux compatibility could compromise a lot the success of this project.

_________________
Pegasos II G4@1GHz 2GB Radeon 9250 256MB
AmigaOS4.1 fe - MorphOS - Debian 9 Jessie

@Fl@sh

It’s too far out to get excited about the A1222 Plus even now! We’re talking Christmas 2021 for someone that isn’t an Early Adopter which probably would require a preorder Q2 2020. The world will have moved on again by then with ray tracing, Dreams PS5 and PSVR2 (probably). AmigaOS is NOT a killer app in itself so an ImageFX, Octamed, Wings Remastered and a Hollywood voucher bundle or similar is very important. This will not be a success without a renewed push to market this thing and assure us it’s worth our money. Vampires, ZZ9000s, MiSTers and even the PS5 and Mx CPU series Macs all compete for the same Covid-19 affected disposable income!

We don’t owe A-EON our undivided support IMHO. Currently, I question the point of the Tabor and whether its market has dried up. Is this a real product or is it like the Amy ‘05/Mick Tinker‘s Boxer/SharkPPC/Phase 5’s ABox products from the past that promised so much and never materialised? Yes, I get it that there’s prototypes and beta testers out there but there’s also 2No. A3000+ prototype machines that we know of but that doesn’t mean that the A3000+ was a released product from C=!

It’s up to A-EON to assure us that the audio, ethernet etc is working now and that there’s enough software support to warrant a purchase. All that has happened is A-EON/Trevor has said it’s up to Matthew/AmigaKit to launch the thing and Matthew has struggled with logistics at a difficult time globally and then we hear virtually nothing other than there’s been at least 1/2 a year delay! “Blame Covid!” should replace, “When it’s done!” But they had 7 years prior to the pandemic

Last edited by BigD on 19-Dec-2020 at 11:59 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 19-Dec-2020 at 11:47 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 19-Dec-2020 at 11:45 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 19-Dec-2020 at 10:36 AM.
Last edited by BigD on 19-Dec-2020 at 10:34 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Thread

All this delay and confusion just focussed me on refurbishing/recapping my old kit or looking forwarded to the new 4K/Virtual Reality/SSD future! The ‘half way house’ of AmigaNG is increasingly squeezed! Why learn Hollywood on a Tabor when I can learn to program AGA games in Blitz Basic or AMOS AGA on my Classic? Why get excited about GPU accelerated video on Tabor when I could watch 4K Blu-Rays on a PS5 and await an upgraded Star Wars Squadrons on PSVR2?

It’s a small market that’s getting smaller as the delays sap interest. I appreciate A-EON’s passion and drive but wish they would get control of this project!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

_________________
That'll Put Marzipan In Your Pie Plate, Bingo
💻 Pro-Amiga, 🌍 Pro-Globalism, 🍅 Pro-Vegan, 🛦 Pro-NATO & 🇪🇺 Pro-Joint EU Defense Intervention Initiative

@Petah

No hate, just a growing sense of ambivalence and a dampening of excitement.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Everblue

Quote:

I have nothing "against" PPC.

Agreed. If someone came out with a new PPC SoC tomorrow with good specs and a good price, I'd say "go for it." The probability is very low, but not zero.

@Spectre660

Quote:

The wait is not a debacle. Manufacturing a production run of boards without being sure that the audio would work might have been though.

Yes, that would definitely qualify as a debacle.

Trevor mentioned at Amiwest that a new A1222 audio driver has been completed, but I haven't seen (or heard) any demos of said driver on Youtube, or anywhere else. Did I somehow miss these?

Last edited by bison on 20-Dec-2020 at 06:40 PM.

_________________
"Unix is supposed to fix that." -- Jay Miner

@bison

It was in Trevor's presentation.

https://youtu.be/ajLvza4BuaA?t=239

@bison

You didn't miss it, it hasn't been shown publicly.

Edit: I stand corrected, see post above.

Last edited by duga on 21-Dec-2020 at 12:51 PM.

@Rob

I wasn't sure if that was coming from an A1222, or just background music added to the video.

_________________
"Unix is supposed to fix that." -- Jay Miner