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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 14-Aug-2023 4:35:53
#481 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@Hammer

what do you think about this chip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6-juFXR9c0

I think what is really dangerous right now for x86, is lot new laptops comes with ChromeOS installed not Windows, most people donít care for legacy, they only want to get onto Twitter, YouTube, Facebook and do a little home banking. Itís already the start of the end for x86.

Security has been pretty rotten in Windows, people want things that are more secure, and is less hazel, they donít want to read 500 pages books about Linux.

1. The downside of ChromeOS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rhb0ID9z4aE
Google is treating Chromebooks like eWaste-ready Andriod phones and Apple iOS devices.
With Google's service-driven OS, "you own nothing."

I have several Vulkan GPU-capable Andriod phones in eWaste.

2. That's an old 64-core Threadripper that is stuck at Zen 2 cores which sucks at Geekbench 5.

3. Ampere Altra ARM CPU is a server market-targeted product, hence it should have been AMD's Eypc server market-targeted product.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mquzak69LOI


Last edited by Hammer on 14-Aug-2023 at 04:53 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 14-Aug-2023 at 04:50 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 14-Aug-2023 at 04:48 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 14-Aug-2023 at 04:38 AM.

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SHADES 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 14-Aug-2023 23:05:17
#482 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 866
From: Melbourne

@Matt3k

Quote:
Even with all that I never really look at the value perspective of my stuff.


New users do though.
Hobbiests, maybe to a lesser extent because of past purchase history and...hope.

If the platform remains in un-feasable land, it's not going to go anywhere because it will not sell.
That means no profit. That means very slow development.

Move to a cheap and continual developed platform and make it work for you.
Seems like if the buy-in is low, people will get curious.
If the experience is good, they will stay and contribute in money and other ways.



I think the other point about what you have spent to what you have got would depress you speaks spades also.

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Matt3k 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 4:22:39
#483 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Feb-2004
Posts: 230
From: NY

@SHADES

Yeah, all the classic hardware purchases were just silly from a price/performance/value standpoint, but it's classic and I love tinkering with 3000's and you have to pay to play. The Apple PowerBook/Mac stuff is getting almost free, I just picked up a PCIe mac system for free in perfect working order and with 2.5GHz, fast bus, Altvec, etc. it is really fast and instantaneous for most things. Watch 1080P video perfectly as well on it.

I agree with you concerning NG stuff and if it is cheap they will come. Choosing Apple products as a platform was a good one, although I used to hate anything apple. But I can see now using "powerful" (very powerful in Amiga terms, just not industry terms) and cheap hardware that is readily available and focus on hammering code on the OS, Development Tools, and Native applications steadily for over 20 years was brilliant (to me anyways). Now with the OS being a really good and usable solution and the video drivers are nearly done, you can start really think about an ISO shift because it all moves over with you as a total solution. Once they do switch platforms it will fix that only remaining issue... Speed with some websites is too slow and I don't think can be totally corrected within the current hardware.

I think it has been a great experience, others mileage may vary... We shall see if they come and contribute as you suggest as an option. I steadily donate to the team, to keep them interested and moving along. Given that 3.19 is well on the way to release and 3.20 I would imaging is being specked out for feature changes like improved multimonitor support (now it is really good) and other changes.

They are also developing contacts and calendar integration for Iris. Everywhere you look they are just running the ball down field and making what is already very good into something even better.

Last edited by Matt3k on 15-Aug-2023 at 04:27 AM.

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agami 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 9:46:04
#484 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1712
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Matt3k

Quote:
Matt3k wrote:
@SHADES

Yeah, all the classic hardware purchases were just silly from a price/performance/value standpoint, but it's classic and I love tinkering with 3000's and you have to pay to play. The Apple PowerBook/Mac stuff is getting almost free, I just picked up a PCIe mac system for free in perfect working order and with 2.5GHz, fast bus, Altvec, etc. it is really fast and instantaneous for most things. Watch 1080P video perfectly as well on it.

I agree with you concerning NG stuff and if it is cheap they will come. Choosing Apple products as a platform was a good one, although I used to hate anything apple. But I can see now using "powerful" (very powerful in Amiga terms, just not industry terms) and cheap hardware that is readily available and focus on hammering code on the OS, Development Tools, and Native applications steadily for over 20 years was brilliant (to me anyways). ...

I agree.
I have always applauded this strategy as an excellent approach. Software first, then if it makes sense at the time, work on bespoke hardware.

I have MorphOS on a PowerBook G4 1.67GHz and a G4 Mac mini 1.5GHz. And since recently I've been shown that MorphOS can run on unofficially supported 2.5GHz Quad-Core G5 Power Mac, when I get some time I'll try and get that going.

To keep it on topic, it has been indicated that the 1.2GHz A1222 will cost a little above the recent and likely final run of the SAM 460.

Meanwhile, right now on eBay a working PowerBook G4 at 1.5GHz and 1GB RAM can be purchased for $359 AUD. But if a laptop is not your speed, then a Mac mini G4 1.5GHz and 1GB RAM is available for $270 AUD. An eMac G4 1.42GHz with 1GB RAM for $390 AUD.

What's that in Euro? Between Ä160 (Mac Mini) and Ä232 (eMac). The kinds of prices one would expect for a used entry-level Amiga-inspired NG system. Even with shipping and a MorphOS license, one is not going past Ä500.

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pixie 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 13:22:54
#485 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3211
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

It is me or is missing some posts?

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The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 14:03:07
#486 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@agami

Could you run DevilutionX PPC or 68k like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvsswLemWdY on
PiStorm32-Lite Emu68 RTG stock Raspberry Pi 4B for the Amiga 1200?
It has 640x480, 800x480, and 1280x720 resolutions and shows frame rates.

SAM460's AmigaOS4 DevilutionX SDL1.2 port https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsOKIB95UHM
DevilutionX 1.4.1 with fullscreen 1280x720 resolution. This youtube link was from https://www.amigans.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?post_id=133894#forumpost133894


To be fair, A1222+ (PCIe 4X lanes, version 1.x) and SAM460 (PCIe 4X lanes, version 1.1) have access to discrete PCIe graphics cards e.g. Radeon HD GCN (2013 to 2016 Polaris with 3D acceleration, minus GCNs such as Fury, Hawaii, Bonaire, and Vega) which doesn't exist for Apple's PowerPC machines.

"PCIe 4X lanes version 1.x" has 1GB/s bandwidth.

Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 01:17 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 03:33 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 03:31 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 02:08 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 02:08 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 02:05 PM.

_________________
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Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3A+/Emu68)

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 14:45:29
#487 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@Hammer

Quote:
Quake 68K can be used to test 68K CPU and FPU emulation


Not same JIT compiler / emulator, it only test Petunia JIT. But take information about some 68K software having issues. It can be it also need special version of Petunia for SPE, it might be its not done.

PowerPC FPU emulator is two different emulators, on load time emulator, and one run time emulator.

AmigaOS4.1 for A1222 has now actually FIVE different emulators:

* 68K interpreter (if JIT is disabled)
* Petunia for 68K to PPC jit.
* FPU load time compiler (whatever).
* Run time FPU emulation.
* EUAE + (tools like RunInUAE etcÖ)

It has now two black lists:
* Compatibility Prefs (for Petunia).
* And one for FPU load time emulator.

FYI, I have WinUAE's AmigaOS 4.1 FE Up2 environment with Petunia (JIT 68K-to-PPC),68K interpreter, and RunInUAE.

I notice AmigaOS 4.1 FE Up2's Compatibility Preference has IBrowse's javascript.library 020 version and RexxMast being JIT disabled.

On Emu68, JIT depth can be set to 1 or 2, but that's usually for WHDLoad games.
Emu68's JIT is enabled at default max depth for IBrowse and RexxMast.

With AmigaOS 4.1 FE Up2's Compatibility Preference for Deluxe Music 2 being JIT disabled, it can run with unstable-freeze issues and wrong note playback (loading example music scores, and clicking on the play button). Was the regression test done correctly?

On the same token, Emu68 (ARM) at max JIT depth or WinUAE-JIT (X86), Deluxe Music 2 works fine.

Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 02:56 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Aug-2023 at 02:51 PM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
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michalsc 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 16:50:57
#488 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 14-Jun-2005
Posts: 381
From: Germany

@pixie

I think this is the moderation which finally woke up

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matthey 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 19:13:23
#489 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 2135
From: Kansas

pixie Quote:

It is me or is missing some posts?


yes

michalsc Quote:

I think this is the moderation which finally woke up


Moderation or censorship? Moderation would be consistently giving warnings and usually temp bans based on forum rule violations with reasons given and documented for review or challenges. There was no moderation for earlier doxing, viscous personal attacks including racial attacks on a German and endless illogical flaming in this thread. No explanation was given for the removal of these posts.

Removing posts for being off topic would be a joke. The A1222 "announcement" is lame as potential customers may not see a product for months or longer in AmigaNever land and production numbers are so low and cost so outrageous that few are going to care especially on a practically dead forum. If the posts were off topic, then the thread has been off topic for so long it does little to correct now. Posts could have been moved to another thread but obviously this announcement is not very important. I can see wanting to keep the topic A1222 related but my last post which was deleted should help potential A1222 customers evaluate the value compared to other products. It had information comparing the single core integer performance (DMIPS/MHz) of low end hardware which is the most important for Amiga performance, especially emulated 68k performance which was being discussed with questionable comparisons being made in this thread.

The ownership of this forum has financial connections and potential conflicts of interest with the developers and producers of the A1222. Without comments on moderation, people may believe posts were removed that were critical of the A1222 or AmigaOS 4. This could lead to the situation where truthful posts are removed and censored ala the U.S. dystopia as exposed by the Twitter/Facebook Files and House congressional investigations. The lack of proper moderation here is unprofessional enough. I wish the woke cancel culture, malinformation and intellectual injustices were not brought into the Amiga realm. We need the Amiga 1984 mentality back and not an Amiga "Orwellian" 1984.

Last edited by matthey on 15-Aug-2023 at 07:31 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 19:48:50
#490 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12856
From: Norway

@matthey

Removing posts are typical how itís done on Amigans, it was not how used be done here. Simply removing spam, or flame bats, perhaps makes the threads more readable, maybe why it was done this way. Perhaps it's a good sign that you should stay on topic and not spam.

This is not Moo Bunny, there used to be moderation here, I donít know why moderators stopped, perhaps some lost interest, no one stepped up to take on the job.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 15-Aug-2023 at 07:53 PM.

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pixie 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 19:49:04
#491 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3211
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@matthey

Well, if we start calling everything woke, it becomes meaningless. There's a lot of censure/cancel culture from conservatives also

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matthey 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 15-Aug-2023 21:48:56
#492 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 2135
From: Kansas

pixie Quote:

Well, if we start calling everything woke, it becomes meaningless. There's a lot of censure/cancel culture from conservatives also


This is not the first time I have been censored, banned, attacked and lied about in the Amiga community and I know I'm not the only one. I try to remain respectful and truthful but I will give my perspective of what I see sometimes. The people who can handle the truth already left the Amiga though and what remains has become dystopian like whether or not it should be called woke.

There are people considered to be on the political right that like censorship and cancel culture.

1. extremist terrorists, fascists, racists, authoritarians, etc.
2. extremists who want to enforce extreme morality through laws (usually religious people)

It is usually not "conservative" to be an extremist. Group 2 may seem somewhat conservative and peaceful on the surface but this system usually ends up in oppression, abuse of the law, abuse in prisons, hypocrisy, etc. Christians should understand this as it is the difference between the old law and the new law but some still don't understand. I am a libertarian leaning Christian conservative which is far from an extremist. Most of the the U.S. Constitution framers had similar views and their documents played a large role in making the U.S. the greatest nation in the world.

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 16-Aug-2023 0:24:42
#493 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@pixie

The Budlight effect is a recent event i.e. conservatives managed to organize themselves.

_________________
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Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3A+/Emu68)

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 16-Aug-2023 0:33:35
#494 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@matthey

Quote:

matthey wrote:
There are people considered to be on the political right that like censorship and cancel culture.

1. extremist terrorists, fascists, racists, authoritarians, etc.
2. extremists who want to enforce extreme morality through laws (usually religious people)

I'll bite.

1. Dixie's racial affirmative action is branded as racist by the US courts since it's racially discriminatory.

https://youtu.be/uqxzPnXhSo0?t=46
Black Democrat politicians argued they don't need Whites on CNN.

2. Your fascist application is the far left's definition. Fascism is a big government interventionist. https://youtu.be/qdY_IMZH2Ko?t=1266

Benito Mussolini emerged from Italian socialism in 1915 in order to become a more faithful interpreter [of the will of] the people of Italy, to whom he, already editor of the socialist paper, Avanti!, wished to devote his new journal, ll popolo d'italia - Giovanni Gentile

The Italian word for a bundle is Fascio.

"Fascio siciliano, plural Fasci Siciliani, any of the organizations of workers and peasants founded in Sicily in the early 1890s" -Britannica
https://www.britannica.com/topic/fascio-siciliano

Communists attempted to distance themselves from another far-leftist movement and branded it as far right. Remember, Libertarians have an extremely small government idealogy, hence there are inconsistencies with the far left's narratives.

3. Facts: Elon Musk's Twitter 2.0 has uncovered bias censorship against conservatives by Dixie Twitter 1.0 administration.

4. The main reason for the US's secular system (1A, freedom of religion, freedom of speech) is to stop European state religious conflicts about the godhead. My country has its own freedom of religion in the constitution.

5. The current morality censorship is driven by the woke e.g. complaining about games like Genshin Impact's artwork. It's a no-brainer when Hollywood's US comics industry is down while East Asian manga and anime are dominating. Beautiful women are natural as basic biology 101.

PS; I can debate against women cloth covering doctrine by certain Christians via Bible NT.
Example
Cor 11:15 clearly states long hair is the head covering (let the Bible interpret itself) is enough despite what Catholic Church's nun cloth head coverings.

The old school Churches with cloth head coverings are teaching commandments of men (Mark 7:9) when Cor 11:15 clearly states long hair as the head covering (let the Bible interpret itself).

I'm not afraid of criticizing old Church teachings and blasting them as commandments of men e.g. old school Ministers teaches women should be a homemaker, which is interpreted as women should stay at home, but Proverbs 31 has a businesswoman who makes her home by earning an income. Old school Ministers are teaching against Bible itself. LOL
In the real world, one can't be a "homemaker" without money.

I can use Bible to debate against clowns at old-school Churches.

Too much of something is dangerous. Seek the Goldilocks zone. i.e. not too hot, not too cold.

These issues are outside of the Amiga computer subjects.

I can handle ppcamiga1's arguments.

Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 09:30 AM.
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Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 12:51 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 12:48 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 12:41 AM.

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Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3A+/Emu68)

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 16-Aug-2023 1:26:37
#495 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@NutsAboutAmiga

The problem with Moo Bunny is the distraction from the Amiga computer topics. We got Twitter for political subjects.

It's normal for "dev kits" that are being sold at low numbers would be expensive or not cost-performance competitive. It's basic economics 101.

Last edited by Hammer on 16-Aug-2023 at 01:27 AM.

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Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
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agami 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 16-Aug-2023 3:38:48
#496 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1712
From: Melbourne, Australia

@pixie

Quote:
pixie wrote:
It is me or is missing some posts?

Where? I donít see any missing posts.

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agami 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 16-Aug-2023 3:59:45
#497 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1712
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Hammer

Quote:
Hammer wrote:
@agami

Could you run DevilutionX PPC or 68k like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvsswLemWdY on
PiStorm32-Lite Emu68 RTG stock Raspberry Pi 4B for the Amiga 1200?
Ö

Iíll add it to the to-do list.

Since I donít have infinite room, looks like Iíll have to bring out the A1200s and pack away the A4000. Poor thing, it gets no love from Apollo or PiStorm/emu68.

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Hammer 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 17-Aug-2023 5:05:09
#498 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5559
From: Australia

@agami

Quote:

agami wrote:
@Hammer

Quote:
Hammer wrote:
@agami

Could you run DevilutionX PPC or 68k like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvsswLemWdY on
PiStorm32-Lite Emu68 RTG stock Raspberry Pi 4B for the Amiga 1200?
Ö

Iíll add it to the to-do list.

Since I donít have infinite room, looks like Iíll have to bring out the A1200s and pack away the A4000. Poor thing, it gets no love from Apollo or PiStorm/emu68.


A3000/A4000 has a 32-bit 68030 bus, hence PiStorm32 needs to be completed.

A2000's 16-bit bus 68000 being common with A500 enables the A2000 to leverage PiStorm's R&D efforts.

Apollo has 32-bit bus-capable Ice Drake and V1200 for A1200, hence it's on Apollo's decision to support A3000/A4000.


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Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3A+/Emu68)

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agami 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 17-Aug-2023 8:00:06
#499 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1712
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Hammer

Quote:
Hammer wrote:
@agami

...
Apollo has 32-bit bus-capable Ice Drake and V1200 for A1200, hence it's on Apollo's decision to support A3000/A4000.

Yep. I was hoping the Kraken would've been released this year.

One of my A1200s has an Icedrake. The other I will setup with PiStorm Lite + Raspberry Pi 4B, since the CM4 interface is not ready yet.

In my small home office/study, I only have room for one OG Amiga. So the A4000 will be packed up and stored away, and I will dust off and set up the A1200.



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BigD 
Re: A1222 production now underway!
Posted on 17-Aug-2023 12:17:52
#500 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 7349
From: UK

@agami

Quote:
since the CM4 interface is not ready yet.


Want do you mean? My CM4 is running perfectly!

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