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      /  some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
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ppcamiga1 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 10-Jan-2024 18:40:34
#661 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 767
From: Unknown

@Karlos

aga is what it is.
in 256 colors nothing more than just slow dumb framebuffer.
no reasons to keep it.
maybe easily changed to any gfx

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ppcamiga1 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 10-Jan-2024 18:43:27
#662 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 767
From: Unknown

@Karlos

leave ppc as it is and start working on something usefull on arm.
emu68 is shit compared to android and there is no reason to use it.
want people use commodity hardware give them something no more than 10 years behind win/lnx/osx.

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WolfToTheMoon 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 10-Jan-2024 19:46:12
#663 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2010
Posts: 1351
From: CRO

@kolla

Quote:
Apple had several niche markets


yes, but I think that the niche that was making them money and keeping Macintosh afloat was digital publishing. Take a look at configured systems from that era and prices they were selling for. They must have been making a fortune on them. I know of some people that used to be in publishing in the early 90s. They were using high end Quadras, you could have bought a small new car for the price of one of the systems back then.

Quote:
And for both Amiga niches, CBM was not selling "the product", others were (SCALA and NewTek)


but the product needed the Amiga HW, same as digital publishing apps and printers on the Mac side. So you sell one expensive computer anyway.

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Karlos 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 10-Jan-2024 19:46:51
#664 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4402
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@ppcamiga1

The reason to use Emu68 is you are an Amiga fan and want to have fun with an actual Amiga and not some overpriced boutique PPC vanity project wannabe with no connection to the original hardware and whose only legitimacy is a partial evolution of the original OS that's ran aground because different parties lay claim to different bits of it and nothing ever gets done on it any more.

Of course you'd know this if you weren't a rabid Amiga hater fixed on the lack of chunky pixels (hint, if you were an Amiga fan you'd have treated it to an RTG upgrade at some point rather than rage quitting over what AGA had or had not). Actual Amiga fans found ways around everything and continue to do so.

Have fun on your underutilised, overpriced heap.

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michalsc 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 10-Jan-2024 20:31:31
#665 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 14-Jun-2005
Posts: 377
From: Germany

@Karlos

Quote:
The reason to use Emu68 is you are an Amiga fan and want to have fun with


Come on, leave him, he will not understand anyway. There is not even a need to explain it to him in his native tongue (Polish) since he is just as bad with it as he is with English. This troll compares M68k JIT with Android system... Next time he will tell you that PowerPC is better than MSOffice.... ;)

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BigD 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 8:21:47
#666 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 7322
From: UK

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

ppcamiga1 wrote:
@Karlos

leave ppc as it is and start working on something usefull on arm.
emu68 is shit compared to android and there is no reason to use it.
want people use commodity hardware give them something no more than 10 years behind win/lnx/osx.


Because Emu68 is fun! I'm not sat there thinking about the Arm chip/RPi as I use it! I guess you're burning candles on your PPC shrine as you compute?

Last edited by BigD on 11-Jan-2024 at 08:22 AM.

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John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

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kolla 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 10:04:20
#667 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 2882
From: Trondheim, Norway

@WolfToTheMoon

Quote:

WolfToTheMoon wrote:
@kolla

Quote:
Apple had several niche markets


yes, but I think that the niche that was making them money and keeping Macintosh afloat was digital publishing.


Or maybe it was research and education - even universities here in Norway had tons of Apple machines and they were used for just about anything.

Or maybe it was SOHO market - I was once asked by a friend to help sorting out some IT problems at a law firm around 1995, and it was all macs.

Quote:

Take a look at configured systems from that era and prices they were selling for. They must have been making a fortune on them. I know of some people that used to be in publishing in the early 90s. They were using high end Quadras, you could have bought a small new car for the price of one of the systems back then.


Yes, they were expensive, but still sold fairly well.

Quote:
Quote:
And for both Amiga niches, CBM was not selling "the product", others were (SCALA and NewTek)


but the product needed the Amiga HW same as digital publishing apps and printers on the Mac side. So you sell one expensive computer anyway.


I don't know exactly how it was with NewTek, but with SCALA, you'd buy a fairly expensive package from SCALA, which included a cheap Amiga from CBM.

https://bigbookofamigahardware.com/bboah/CategoryList.aspx?mid=16

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WolfToTheMoon 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 13:28:36
#668 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2010
Posts: 1351
From: CRO

@kolla

Quote:
Or maybe it was research and education - even universities here in Norway had tons of Apple machines and they were used for just about anything.

Or maybe it was SOHO market - I was once asked by a friend to help sorting out some IT problems at a law firm around 1995, and it was all macs.

Quote:


They were big in the education market in the US - not so much in Europe(Norway being relatively well off could afford Macs in education, most other countries couldn't). But those were probably mostly Apple IIs all the way into the 90s.
I don't know about the research and development - I don't think that the classic Macintosh OS was suitable for those tasks, but there were Unix OSes for the Mac so it's possible.

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BigD 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 16:11:07
#669 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 7322
From: UK

@WolfToTheMoon

We had Acorn for education in the UK before PCs took over. Mac only had Desktop Publishing but they were good for that! Job's obsession with font typefaces paid off!

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ppcamiga1 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 17:38:02
#670 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 767
From: Unknown

@Karlos

emu68 like other crap from szulc is shit. accept that.
there is no reason to waste time on shit called emu68
when you can just use android on exactly the same hardware.
and do everything in tiny fraction of time wasted on emu68.
on exactly the same hardware.
want switch to arm. give people something as good as android.

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Karlos 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 11-Jan-2024 20:38:03
#671 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4402
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@ppcamiga1

Remind us, what have you ever created? Apart from a bad smell, I mean?

Quote:

NG/PPC is shit. accept that.
there is no reason to waste time on shit called NG/PPC
when you can just use Linux on exactly the same hardware.
and do everything in tiny fraction of time wasted on NG/PPC.
on exactly the same hardware.


Strange how easily that substitution worked.

Last edited by Karlos on 11-Jan-2024 at 08:57 PM.

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Hammer 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 5:06:05
#672 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5273
From: Australia

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

ppcamiga1 wrote:
@Karlos

leave ppc as it is and start working on something usefull on arm.
emu68 is shit compared to android and there is no reason to use it.
want people use commodity hardware give them something no more than 10 years behind win/lnx/osx.

Most Android or Chrome devices are dead door stops after 2 to 3 years when their OEM vendor stops official support.

Saving the planet from so-called Environmental, Social, and Corporate Governance (ESG) Google while promoting rapid eWaste products amounts to hypocrisy.

Apple devices are anti-repair.

Last edited by Hammer on 12-Jan-2024 at 05:08 AM.

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Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

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kolla 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 5:32:34
#673 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 2882
From: Trondheim, Norway

@Hammer

Quote:

Apple devices are anti-repair.


Have you tried? I keep seeing this claim, but never had much problem fixing mines when in need.

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Hammer 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 6:04:27
#674 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5273
From: Australia

@Hypex

Quote:
It didn't need too. it just needed to run Cubase, as basic as it looked


In 1992, Cubase was released for Windows 3.0.
In 1993, Cubase Score for Windows 3.11.

Quote:

I didn't think to try that. But RTG complicates my Pi. I'm always missing a cable to go from native to RTG. By comparison my A4000 is luxury. Just need one cable to the monitor and the hardware does the rest.

Shapeshifter with RTG runs well on PiStorm-Emu68 accelerated Amiga.

I have a fast switcher between RTG (HDMI-to-VGA) and Amiga RGB (VGA).


_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

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Hammer 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 6:16:36
#675 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5273
From: Australia

@WolfToTheMoon

Quote:

WolfToTheMoon wrote:

Apple endured better fate while relying on just as niche markets.
I know that quikpak and similar companies were still selling A4000T to that market in the late 90s and Amigas were used on smaller TV stations even well after that. It certainly wasn't enough to support the entire platform, but it was very expensive hardware and probably far more profitable per unit than selling A500s and like.

In the second half of the 90s I'd argue, with hindsight, the best market for anyone that ended up with the Commodore/Amiga IP was handhelds and such.

Mainstream social media YouTube didn't exist in the 1990s.

Apple has DTP and MS Office. I was running MS Office Mac on my Amiga 3000. A full Apple Macintosh platform switch was very close during 1994-1995.

With my Dad's contacts, I sold my Amiga 3000 to a small TV production company in 1996.
If I had the A1200 in 1993, I wouldn't have sold it.

Commodore's big boxed Amigas unit sales weren't even at Escom's 400,000 unit Y1995 level.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

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Hammer 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 6:18:57
#676 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 5273
From: Australia

@kolla

Quote:

kolla wrote:
@Hammer

Quote:

Apple devices are anti-repair.


Have you tried? I keep seeing this claim, but never had much problem fixing mines when in need.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIFQC8iA65k
From Louis Rossmann, Apple withholds calibration tool for sleep sensors on modern Macbooks from independent repair shops


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3e-b-7jCYk
Astonishing Anti Repair Practices By Apple In the Last 15 Years from Hugh Jeffreys.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYIX-IEB41I
Parts pairing will be the death of Apple repair, refurbishing, and reuse from RDKL, Inc.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yXCKMNEJUo
Inside Apple's M3 MacBook Pro: Teardown, X-Rays, and Parts Pairing Drama! from
iFixit


PS; I have a Framework 13 AMD laptop.

Last edited by Hammer on 12-Jan-2024 at 10:21 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 12-Jan-2024 at 06:33 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 12-Jan-2024 at 06:31 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 12-Jan-2024 at 06:20 AM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

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Karlos 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 18:24:40
#677 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4402
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@michalsc

Quote:

michalsc wrote:

Next time he will tell you that PowerPC is better than MSOffice.... ;)


To be fair, if I had the choice of spending time messing around on a PPC machine, or spending time messing around on MSOffice, even for me, that's a no-brainer :D

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zidz 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 12-Jan-2024 21:26:39
#678 ]
Member
Joined: 9-Nov-2016
Posts: 13
From: Unknown

@ppcamiga1


I get so sad when people say stuff like this. Isn't people allowed to use or create what they like and enjoy? The ONLY reason why we have ANYTHING newly produced Software or Hardware after Commodore wanished is because people enjoyed creating it, and others enjoyed using it. It will continue that way. Let people do what they enjoy, else the whole Amiga scene will fully stop.

We can discuss what the very next hardware or software could be that eventually would get more people into the scene. But our beloved Amiga will most likely stay in this shape, a way or another.

I will continue buy stuff to my Amiga that I enjoy and do what I can to keep it from malfunctioning. I hope to some day buy a Minimig/AmiCube 5000 and a Vampire motherboard when they are in line with their future plans of creating discrete components for everything. Others might not enjoy those new things, but please let me and others have the pleasure enjoying these things and do not throw shit on those making a difference for others.

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Karlos 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 13-Jan-2024 0:23:12
#679 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4402
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@zidz

Don't fret over what ppcamiga1 says. He's a TLM (Tiny Language Model) bot that picks up on certain watch words and then spouts variation drivel. His favourites include "Amiga has not chunky pixels", "AGA|68K|Pi is worthless shit", "Only PPC is good because it has 32-bit big endian like 68K" (funny because 68K is also worthless shit, so why is that good?).

Recently he learned to use the phrase "Emu68 is only 1/6th speed of native ARM". I was impressed because I actually suspect he was incapable of deploying a new phrase.

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OneTimer1 
Re: some words on senseless attacks on ppc hardware
Posted on 14-Jan-2024 14:58:52
#680 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 973
From: Unknown

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:

AGA was made even worse by still lacking a MIDI port ...


The Amiga could actually do MIDI, the ACIA in Paula could run the right bit rate, you just need a few parts converting the signals of the RS232 into MIDI compatible signals.

You can easily solder such a simple interface by yourself:
http://davbucci.chez-alice.fr/index.php?argument=elettronica/midiint/midiint.inc
https://rastport.com/products/KA12/

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