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      /  What future for the Amiga platform?
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AmigaBlitter 
What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 19:01:55
#1 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 26-Sep-2005
Posts: 3415
From: Unknown

Hello,

a year is passed and no noticeable progress happens. What the future of the Amiga? Are all the parties ready to bury the axe of war and cooperate?

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nikosidis 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 19:18:53
#2 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 9-Dec-2008
Posts: 947
From: Norway, Oslo

@AmigaBlitter

To me it is very exiting times. Classic are back with the Vampire stand alone and accellerators.
Even AROS found its home now and the main developer are working with the Vampire team.

There been some quality game, demo releases for Amiga classic in 2019 and there will be much more in 2020.

All amiga NG systems have failed and will continue to fail. Amiga is 68k and that is where the interest are. Even Hyperion have seen this and updated classic AmigaOS.

We now have new hardware and updated OS in AROS.

I hope that there can be an agreement in the future to license and sell Vampire hardware and AROS with the Amiga logo and name.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 20:37:47
#3 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2181
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA


I agree with nikosidis.

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BigD 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 20:59:19
#4 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5106
From: UK

@Samurai_Crow

Can't see that the Vampire Standalone is available anywhere and the price isn't finalised and the product isn't even listed on the Apollo Team's website!

Maybe I was wrong to think it'll be available before the Tabor? Strange Amiga-land product launches where products are demonstrated on YouTube and not available until 2 years later and even then only after pre-ordering or joining a queue!

Progress of sorts....

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hese 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 21:03:34
#5 ]
New Member
Joined: 15-Aug-2011
Posts: 9
From: Unknown

@AmigaBlitter

Amiga classic is going strong with new motherboards released this and past few years.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 21:15:12
#6 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2181
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA

@BigD

Limited numbers shipping next week from Vesalia. http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge.php?b=5¬e=25683&z=2UzaE4

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bison 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 21:59:17
#7 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 1519
From: N-Space

@AmigaBlitter

It doesn't seem any worse than usual. Everything is in a sort of holding pattern until the results of the Hyperion vs. Cloanto lawsuit are known.

Last edited by bison on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:00 PM.

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ppcamiga1 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:00:18
#8 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 166
From: Unknown

nikosidis is former AROS x86 follower, and as others AROS x86 followers after rejection of this crap
AROS x86 by community has attack of Amiga orthodoxy.

Vampire is where it was one year ago.
Still no MMU, no 3D and cpu one hundert time slower than ppc.
It is fastest 68k Amiga solution but nothing more.

Still the some software that work on Amiga NG ppc but working slower.

AROS 68k is still too slow to usable on anything other than uae.

Amiga NG ppc is also where it was one year ago.

Nothing changes by this year.

Last edited by ppcamiga1 on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:02 PM.

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Fransexy 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:08:14
#9 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Jun-2004
Posts: 2332
From: Elche (Alicante), spain

@AmigaBlitter

Interesting news. I'm a big fan of PowerPC but if Amiga should have to change Isa this could be a good candidate

https://www.google.com/amp/s/wccftech.com/huawei-preps-desktop-pc-motherboards-featuring-up-to-8-core-kunpeng-920-arm-v8-cpus/amp/

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OneTimer1 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:16:07
#10 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 535
From: Unknown

Quote:

Vampire is where it was one year ago.


The VampireV4 is now available, at least they sold regular board.
Compatibility with 68k MMU and FPU might not be their priority.

Quote:

Amiga NG ppc is also where it was one year ago.


There was some kind of presentation of MorphOS running on AMD64, it has a new kernel and should get a PPC emulator (JIT) for MOS PPC programs and over MOS PPC also a 68k emulator (JIT)-


MiSter is the cheapest FPGA Am!ga but could be outperformed by UAE on a RasPI.

AROS on Raspi (Big Endian) will get a 68k emulator (JIT) with a transparent emulation like it is used in AOS4 or MOS.

That's a lot. There is not much use for cooperation at OS level, but at least some application programmers could try and compiler their software for different platforms. (Final Writer is still in development ...)

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:25 PM.

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OneTimer1 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:28:13
#11 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 535
From: Unknown


Quote:

Fransexy wrote:
... if Amiga should have to change Isa


I don't believe there will ever be a company called Amiga again, the same goes for a computer with such a name.

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OlafS25 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:29:12
#12 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5664
From: Unknown

@BigD

Vesalia is starting delivering 16.12

http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge.php?b=5¬e=25683&z=s2iBAT

Last edited by OlafS25 on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:40 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:33:47
#13 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5664
From: Unknown

@ppcamiga1

on AGA Aros 68k already is good useable

RTG is slow still but Aros devs will work on it so do not worry about it

On UAE it outperforms many of your PPC solutions. Vampire is slower of course but obviously there is a need it is satisfying. If it would be about rationality everyone would solely use a PC with Windows and nothing amiga related

I do not know why you call Aros all the time crap. Now that Aros main branch is 68k the situation is much more interesting and lots of software working on it. Much that was critisized at X86 is solved by that.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:53 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 9-Dec-2019 22:36:09
#14 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5664
From: Unknown

@OneTimer1

one of the Aros devs is working on a kind of Amithlon on RPi based on Aros 68k and Aros Roms. Of course only software runs on it solely using the OS. But still interesting project (as you already mentioned)

Last edited by OlafS25 on 09-Dec-2019 at 10:37 PM.

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agami 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 7:21:13
#15 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 561
From: Melbourne, Australia

@AmigaBlitter
Crystal ball gazing: My favourite thing to do.

Any number of possible futures can be imagined, though not many of them have a high likelihood of eventuating. Sure, odds have been beaten before, and "stranger things have happened", but based on the current trend, the Amiga Platform does not have a good outlook.

Many might look at the current state and see the proverbial glass being half full. "Things haven't been this good in a long time. We have AROS working on multi-core support, we have A1222 to look forward to, MorphOS is working on their move to x86, standalone Vampire will give us the fastest ever 68k machine". Amazing, right?

Wrong. The above is a quantitative view. More things does not always mean better.
A qualitative analysis will show that all those do not a unified platform make. In fact, they are all pulling in their own direction. Some purists will argue than only Hyperion's AmigaOS 3.x and 4.x is the "Amiga Platform". Then there's the lawsuits about who has ultimate claim to classic Amiga OS. Which in turn halts development as energy and money is directed toward legal matters.

The glass is not just half empty, the liquid level is near the bottom. So the future of the platform, or rather the hotchpotch ecosystem is not looking good. AROS development has slowed down, as has development of MorphOS. AmigaOS 4.2 has achieved mythical status, and the nouveau-retro V4 Vampire like the V2 before it can not be manufactured fast enough to quench the thirst of Amigans that have spent too many years in the desert.

I dare say, there is no follow-up act to the A1222, or Amiga Forever, or AmigaOS 4.x, or AROS, or even Vampire V4. All of these are pretty much the "end of the line" for initiatives laid down one and two decades ago. What comes after 68080? What is the killer app for any of the Amiga NG operating systems? Will the other cores of a PowerPC, x86, ARM CPU ever be utilised? What is the Amiga Platform? What reason would a new developer have to buy any Amiga ecosystem wares? Is anyone working on answering these questions? Why should they? Because the answers to those questions, will answer the titular question of this post.

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KimmoK 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 7:50:43
#16 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5187
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@bison

Indeed, I hope once legal stuff is finally solved after 20 years of "legal limbo", we start to see more steady progress towards "third generation".

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ck2gpqjl2NS4nQjLGl2IVf-Ikn--dEdP/view?usp=sharing

A lot of stuff to think about vs roadmap etc.:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cYZnD_rI844TjoVn31nLkwHX5Y0jn5pJ/view?usp=sharing

**************
Important things on the Amiga niche.

for Existing users:
-gradual OS+HW improvements & updates
-new SW & more SW

New old users:
-easy to access & affordable emulated systems
-support organization/wiki for classic+NG
-new SW & more SW
-recapped/remade HW for those who want to continue their "teenage-fun"
-NG HW for those who fall in love with AmigalikeOS NG (affordable!)

New new users:
-easy to use, simple, stable and "Amigalike" systems
-support organization/wiki for classic+NG
-retro systems (remade HW)
-easy to access & affordable emulated systems
-Affordable NG HW with good SW bundle
-new SW & more SW (+ some small special stuff & features, if possible)

->
Continued and improved support towards SW development is the most important part?
To get any new user our systems should be fun to use without head-ache.

Last edited by KimmoK on 10-Dec-2019 at 08:12 AM.

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// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

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Trixie 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 9:25:36
#17 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 1-Sep-2003
Posts: 1888
From: Czech Republic

@ppcamiga1

Quote:
Amiga NG ppc is also where it was one year ago.

Which only shows that, as regards OS4 at least, you have no clue about the actual development.

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AmigaOne X5000/020 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon RX 560 / ESI Juli@ / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition
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kolla 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 9:44:44
#18 ]
Super Member
Joined: 20-Aug-2003
Posts: 1400
From: Trondheim, Norway

@OneTimer1

Quote:

MiSter is the cheapest FPGA Am!ga but could be outperformed by UAE on a RasPI.


You can run UAE on the MiSTer as well, you know...

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kolla 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 9:46:51
#19 ]
Super Member
Joined: 20-Aug-2003
Posts: 1400
From: Trondheim, Norway

@OlafS25

Quote:

I do not know why you call Aros all the time crap.


Why not, Thomas Richter calls it pointless

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OlafS25 
Re: What future for the Amiga platform?
Posted on 10-Dec-2019 10:32:34
#20 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5664
From: Unknown

@kolla

Thomas Richter is part of the dark power

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