@Rogue and others

I never intended to slander fleccys work. Perhaps I was just fed up with the ongoing babble about a fantastic future and an OS nearly there......or so they said. I belived in all of mcewens announcements. I read all of fleccys Q&A's, and the people involved in the amiga before them - And as time passed by, I just stopped beliving them (especially mcewen) in the end. The only thing I belive in is the work of you and the rest of the guys and gals around OS4.....THAT'S THE ONLY THING I BELIVE!

Everything that A.inc will tell me now or in the future, I will politely stuff in the department of "not to be trusted".

You can react as you wish, but I have learned the hard way not to trust these guys......and I'm sorry it came to this. Oh and you have to think about one thing too. Those people expressing harsh feelings towards a.inc or whatever, are usally just people with a lot of feelings towards the amiga. They mostly only react like that, because they're dissapointed.....nothing else. Try and understand that, before calling people pathetic whiners.

The same people have been here for the amiga for 10-20 years, and are the true backbone of this community. Yeah maybe they are fed up with dissapointments, and act childish, but nevertheless they are to be understanded from an emotional point of view. Im sure Realize once was a amigalover of the best sort, but the various companys, announcements, etc has turned him and myself (and others) into dissapointed childish disbelivers. (even though I never will loose my hope for the amiga)

Try and understand this, and maybe give us some "emotional credit" for being like this. You could express some empathy towards the freaks like me and him, and stop beliving that we're attacking you. It's not at all about you or hyperion and the other developers. It's about many years before that, of lies, vaporware, etc.......that's were it all come from......every time there was a new lie, there was a stroke against our amigahearts......everytime!!

But I still have this childish hope, that A.inc will come true, and start repairing my bleeding amigaheart. If they do, I'm sure i'll forgive them. The best move they ever made was the deal with eyetech and hyperion, securing AOS, whatever happened to them.......that was true caretaking of the OS, and I respect them enormously for that move.

And every time you or someone else announce new stuff for AOS you also repair some of the damage made by others before you........THANKS alot for that Rogue.

@To all members here

What has made you suffer the most in the amiga history???

What has made you most joyfull in the amiga history???

My best....it was the primetime around the release of the AGA chipset. That was my best period.

My worst.......when Commodore went down in 94

Does anybody else here remember their past history of amiga feelings???

Edited by Bodie_CI5: People, please don't post all-capital titles. Oh and Hondo, please desist from using the word "Fleccy". Cheers

Last edited by Theodosius on 16-Mar-2005 at 08:15 PM.
Last edited by Hondo_DK on 16-Mar-2005 at 03:29 PM.
Last edited by Hondo_DK on 16-Mar-2005 at 01:33 PM.

_________________
On Planet Boing Trevor is God

@Hondo_DK

I know where u r coming from, i been an Amigan since KS1.2, and the only thing that keeps us here, is the community, but the bitching, and back-stabbing between the community has only helped rip it apart in the past.

To succeed we all need to stand together and voice our oppinions ot the people who have the power to get the Amiga back where it should be, in the hearts and minds off all the creative people, who have to use terrible OS's, because that's all they think is out there.

btw my 1st A500, Batman pack....... oh i loved that machine.

_________________
Dark Lord Design Wicked Solutions For Damned Problems

@Hondo_DK

I can only say that I understand and feel for everything you have said. The only slight difference is that I would say to give the new AInc. a chance. KMOS has done nothing wrong. In keeping quiet and fulfilling the T-Shirt order they have only done good things.

The slight problem comes with the words and actions of previous staff that may well continue to be employed by the new AInc. I can understand if you don't want to trust them and for the very small number of Amigans left I can guess that a certain percentage will never trust them again and that is completely understandable. It is a problem that KMOS will probably define as unimportant as it affects only a small number of people. If the new AInc. is to be successful it has to target new customers again where most will know nothing of the Amiga since 1994 - which is a good thing.

Some good questions

Suffer most? - CBM. Mehdi Ali and his hideously poor business decisions. To destroy something so good is a crime.

Most joyful? - Seeing the A500 at home for the first time in spring 1988 playing Sword of Sodan.

Being the best was also cool. Knowing that the Amiga was number 1 and being so successful rocked. The time from 1988 to 1991.

_________________
Sam

@Hondo_DK

You are entitled to remain sceptical. It's your right ;D

I say judge your opinions on actual deliverance rather than talk.

Amiga Inc together with Hyperion and Eyetech has delivered a PPC based platform with AmigaOS on. In addition they will provide an OS upgrade for classic hardware and there will be hardware upgrades for the very same classic omputers out imminent.

In addition, after having a rough time both with experiencing the dotcom bubble and companies using guerilla marketing attacks and malintentioned lawsuits it seems the boat is again steady and steaming ahead when KMOS/Amiga Inc. stood by a two year old promise of delivering t-shirts.

Looking forward to the new site launch and the IRC conference.

_________________
Nicolas Mendoza

@nicomen
It is so cliche to say everything is dark before the light. I am having a down day myself. Here in Ontario it has been a long cold winter. I think at times that winter will never end. There is a Spring coming. Through experience I know that is true.
In a Jungian sense the winter is the time of darkness when we huddle around our fires and dream and plan and hope. Spring is the time we ALL burst out again and do great things. I know it sounds like a silly metaphor, but it is true. I have seen it 56 winters now and it is always the same. Hold on to your dreams at least till we get past April Fools Day.

Best,
John Paul

Quote:

Hondo_DK wrote: @To all members here What has made you suffer the most in the amiga history???

1.When Commondore went bust.
2.When Phase 5 was closed down.
3.When my last Amiga friend left the amiga scene.

Quote:

What has made you most joyfull in the amiga history???

1.The first time i saw an Amiga 500 in action. I still remember when i saw a demo of
Space Ace =) It looked like a cartoon.
2.When i bought my first amiga. (A500)
3.When the A1200/A4000 was launched. (AGA was SO cool :) )
4.When i got my Blizzard 1230.
5.When i got my Blizzard PPC 603e+
6.When i got my Mediator.
(7.When i got OS4 for my Amiga.)

Lost of more steps too. But these where special.

Quote:

Does anybody else here remember their past history of amiga feelings???

It's the only reason i'm still here. Not because i belive in a total come back. But for nostalgic reasons and memories.

The feeling of the Amiga comunity is all gone... More or less. Back in the golden days there were lots of Amiga users out there. And if you just said Amiga in a room full of strangers you instantly had atleast one friend. All Amiga users had a single goal and company.

We were one nation so to speak. But now it's Black/blue/red/nostalgic/angry/emulator groups out there. The feel is gone. Nothing is saying it can't come back in another form. But the old feel is dead. RIP.

//Niclas

@Hondo_DK

I give some background in that thread.

basically, i was privileged to be one of the pioneers (if i may put it that way) of the digital revolution in film-making that changed the way things were done in special effects. and i don't mean the effects now done in films is "better" than the effects done 100 years ago. good and great effects have been done all along by ARTISTS - which is more important than the particular technique used.

what i mean is that it's now possible for more talented and dedicated people to get involved in film-making. I was able to buy a computer and on my own time (since there was no such thing in those days as computer animation classes) teach myself what i needed to know so i could later on get hired to work on bigger projects.
because of amiga and the CONCEPT of amiga - computers for everyone, especially artists - people were able to start small companies which could supply effects for films. the company i joined started with THREE amigas. a 2000, a 3000 and a 4000.
most of the people who did effects and still do started with amigas.
THAT is the legacy.
THAT is what i'm proud of.

and no company, now or then, can take that away from me.

_________________
"In terms of worship, I worship the God of Irony.
That's the only God that I know exists." Terry Gilliam

@Hondo_DK

Well, I know Gary Peake from before he worked for Amiga Inc. I'm sure he wouldn't have worked for Amiga Inc if he had the idea they where lying to us.

Whatever you think, I do think Fleecy had the best intentions. I do believe he never should have talked about anything other then OS4, perhaps a bit about DE, but never anything about AmigaOS5 with DE integrated. That's to far into the future, to much can and will (has) happened.

Anyway, would Hyperion still be working on OS4 if they believed Amiga Inc was lying to us ? If Amiga Inc wasn't honest to us, how honest would they be to them ?

_________________
~
Everything you say will be misquoted and used against you..
~

@Nickman

Quote:

We were one nation so to speak. But now it's Black/blue/red/nostalgic/angry/emulator groups out there. The feel is gone. Nothing is saying it can't come back in another form. But the old feel is dead. RIP.

It`s so true - even here, the last redoubt, it seems like every other thread sees someone being reprimanded for broaching a sensitive/taboo subject
It`s so diluted now, that Amiga community feeling....

Last edited by Frags on 16-Mar-2005 at 05:53 PM.
Last edited by Frags on 16-Mar-2005 at 05:52 PM.

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Fraggle

- insert profound text here -

@Frags

Quote:

It`s so true - even here, the last redoubt

I don't believe that's true. Even in the old days there were factions such as those who had big box Amigas and those who had wedge systems, those who hated AMOS and those that loved it etc.

It's just that back then there was no Internet so there was no real opportunity for groups to form in the way that they do now such as MOS and AROS and all of the other spin-offs. All of my Amiga news came monthly from a magazine it was all one-way communication. Sure there were BBS and rudimentary email but that was for the minority.

All it needs is for KMOS to hit things hard with a good plan and some investment. the basis - OS4, the micro A1, Project Reality, is already here.

So it's not all over, it's not all finished, at least not until KMOS reveal their plans. If they are firmly DE/TAO and there is no mention of the Amiga as us remaining old guard know it then, yes, I will (after 11 years) finally accept that the Amiga is dead.

But hey! Even if it is all over it has been one hell of an interesting ride - the Amiga has given me a lot over the time from 1988 to 1995 and I thank the original team for it!

Last edited by -Sam- on 16-Mar-2005 at 06:52 PM.
Last edited by -Sam- on 16-Mar-2005 at 06:44 PM.

_________________
Sam

Obviously discounting the multiple "deaths" fo the Amiga, my worst moment(s) was when the magazines AmigaFormat and CU Amiga went down. Then I felt really lonely in the Amiga world...It was a really bad sign of the things to come.

Best moments were when I finally (after months of hard work) managed to buy my first Amiga, an A500 and later my treasured A1200.

@Hondo_DK

I disagree on all point, Amiga Inc did not get the break they need, and all the BS from the dark side, now this, is the dark side closing in on AmigaWorld.net, we now have what we have waited for from they day commodore passed over to the empty void of the dark side, we need seek opportunity in the fact that AmigaOS is back, and kicking, and it run's on old and new hardware, so what's the problem, AmigaDE where losing street, some say that this where just way get some cash to finance it all, what AmigaDE have done is void (not bad or god), they most have belived in the Amiga comunity or none of this where going to become a reallity an new Amiga computer and a OS, what more can you ask for, the AmigaDE where just a side track,

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 17-Mar-2005 at 04:54 PM.

_________________
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/
Facebook::LiveForIt Software for AmigaOS

@-Sam-

I don't think that TAO or DE are a permanent solution. There is alot of skeptisism out there right now, but I have a better feeling than I have had in a long, long time. I think the Amiga is in an up swing, and in a big way. For 10 years we had nothing new, no new hardware. Now we have at last new hardware and a new OS based on the OS we love the most. Amiga OS.

It is a common thing for any large group to have a little in fighting and difference of opinion. I too think Fleecy's intentions were there. I think it is really hard to bite your lip when you have some great ideas and plans even though many plans are just what they are. Plans! Nothing concrete in that. In fact, I am glad some of those plans were scrapped. I like the direction we are headed in right now. Major hurdles have been over come.

I think we have more tools now to communicate with people directly involved in the Amiga. Hyperion has been in constant communication with all of us here. I have got to admit they have more will power than myself to keep tight lipped about what needs to be.

A big oportunity is this q/a session with Gary Hare. What an oportunity! We never had this sort of communication with Commodore. I am sure he will be very carefull in what he says and he needs to be. We need to ask him the right questions and give him a feel for what we desire as well.

It won't help if we start throwning insults around or talking trash. That stuff only accomplishes ticking people off. Use of colourfull metaphores and the word 'you' will seldome if ever give any desired result.

My confidence in KMOS is growing. They have delivered so far as I have seen, even though it did take quite a while for the T's. I won't say that I have total confidence yet, but we really have no choice at this point do we? You have to give everyone a chance to prove themselves. So far as what I have seen KMOS has. Hyperion definitly has as well as Eytech. I am eager to find out on Sunday what Gary has to say. I find it amazing that I have the oportunity to talk to the man that holds all the cards.

Also, don't worry about the Amiga Heart, it comes right back with every use of an Amiga Computer. Seriously though, most that are complaining have not even tried the new A1 at all. If they did they would understand that it was in fact the OS itself that gave us that great feel that we all know so well. The OS is the heart of Amiga. Even in this pre release stage this OS Rocks!!! You won't even want to use your old Amga after using the new one. It is that big of a difference.

@nzv58l

Good call, I couldn't agree with you more! We do finally seem to be moving into a coherent direction and, the odd hiccup notwithstanding, there does seem to be real progress being made. We have a new OS, a new hardware platform and, most importantly, with all these changes, the spirit and feel of the Amiga has remained totally intact. :)

_________________
"Do or do not - there is no try."
AmigaOne XE G4 - 1GB RAM, UDMA133 200GB HDDx2, Sil
680 PCI, Radeon, Soundblaster Live . . .

Quote:

Hondo_DK wrote: What has made you suffer the most in the amiga history???

It's a bit funny, but I think it is when the Walker was scrapped, then
for the frist time I realized that Amiga was not "back" at all. I thought if they
couldn't deliver a machine which seemed to be this close to completiom
then they where in big trouble. The way was only downhill after.

Quote:

What has made you most joyfull in the amiga history???

-Playing "Interceptor" for the frist time on my A500.
-I also have to add that seeing the Space Ace animation made me go whoo.
-The arrival of my brand new A1200 to my local post office. ( Nothing beats this )

_________________
AmigaOS or MorphOS on x86 would sell orders of magnitude more than the current,
hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

@Hondo_DK

Quote:

I never intended to slander fleccys work.

But nonetheless misspell his name...

Quote:

Everything that A.inc will tell me now or in the future, I will politely stuff in the department of "not to be trusted".

This is the part that I don't really get. Sure, we've all had our miscalculated release dates (and that is the reason why I don't do it anymore), but what makes Fleecy's words "not to be trusted"?

Quote:

What has made you most joyfull in the amiga history???

I was completely blown away when I first saw an Amiga in 1988. This specific machine was an Amiga 500, and its owner had a demo disk called "Music Invasion II" by Jungle Command. It played the rather famous Axel F. tune. I immediately fell in love with that crate and immediately abandoned the thought of going for an Atari ST.

The second was when OS 4/ExecSG booted for the first time into the initial shell. It had been almost two weeks of constant bugfixing in the kernel and emulator. Every iteration managed to climb a bit futher up the ladder of ROM modules. Then came the moment that the Early Startup Menu appeared. I could actually even move the mouse. We immediately clicked "boot without startup sequence" and the machine dumped us into the initial CLI. We then decided to type "LoadWB", and where completely shocked when the workbench actually loaded (I even have a half-minute movie file we recorded that day).

The third time was more or less the same procedure with the AmigaOne. We had two upcoming demonstrations and only two weeks time to get things to run. The first version booted from some InitRD-like static RAM disk, with Picasso96 and a hacked-together AmigaOne.card (part of that still made it into AmigaOne.card that was used on the pre-release). When I saw the result, I immediately thought of the names of a few people that needed to eat their words

Quote:

What has made you suffer the most in the amiga history???

Actually, this was when Jim Collas left Gateway/Amiga. Sure, I was as down as everybody when Commodore went bust, but somehow the whole Jim Collas thing was more personal. I was at the WOA show when Collas made his speech about the future of Amiga, and it all sounded really cool. I was dreadfully disappointed when it finally went all bust.

Last edited by Rogue on 16-Mar-2005 at 08:33 PM.

_________________
Seriously, if you want to contact me do not bother sending me a PM here. Write me a mail

@Rogue

God, I remember that speech . . . We were so THRILLED, everyone was cheering - it was almost like a rock concert! JurassicC and I even smuggled some beer into the auditorium as I recall :o)

Last edited by Frags on 16-Mar-2005 at 08:51 PM.

_________________
Fraggle

- insert profound text here -

@Rogue

Quote:

The second was when OS 4/ExecSG booted for the first time into the initial shell. It had been almost two weeks of constant bugfixing in the kernel and emulator. Every iteration managed to climb a bit futher up the ladder of ROM modules. Then came the moment that the Early Startup Menu appeared. I could actually even move the mouse. We immediately clicked "boot without startup sequence" and the machine dumped us into the initial CLI. We then decided to type "LoadWB", and where completely shocked when the workbench actually loaded (I even have a half-minute movie file we recorded that day).

Rogue, your bringing me to tears here at work and embarasing me in front of all my co-workers! You should see if you could get that movie file posted to this site. I'm sure most of us would love to see it...also, have an extra hanky warning on it!

@nzv58l

Better yet. Make it a "easter egg" in OS4 Final. I actualy sugested this a long time ago when Rogue mentioned it the first time.

I then got a reply saying something like "We'll see"

From my observations over the last few months, I would say that the Red/Blue/Black thing has subsided. The reasons don't matter, the fact is that we now often see MOS people posting on this board, without raising hackles. Both sides have changed to make this happen at last.

We all hope that Hyperion can continue to finance Amiga software development, and Eyetech can continue to finance AmigaOne hardware development. The market is still too small to support more big players, but without these two companies, we would all be using Linux and Amithlon.

My worst time: when the Boxer was abandoned so many years ago. It seemed that there could be no revival of the Amiga hardware for a long time, if ever.

People can decry Fleecy Moss and Bill McEwen for their over-optimistic "sales talk", but they came in at a time when we had no prospects of new hardware or software. Well, with their efforts, it did restart, we have new hardware and software. Sure, others may have taken over, but if Fleecy and Bill had not started it, nothing would have happened.

What we have now will give me something to play with for many years yet. And I won't have to use that other OS that is slower than OS4 on a CPU of 2½-3 times the speed.

tony

_________________
cheers
tony

Hyperion Support Forum: http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php