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/  Forum Index
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      /  Open RedAlert!!
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PosterThread
Mr_Capehill 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 9:57:50
#121 ]
Super Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2003
Posts: 1932
From: Yharnam

@BigD

Source code for the DLLs, apparently not for the game engine itself.

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 11:39:53
#122 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@Mr_Capehill

Ok. This link explains it best.

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=EA-Open-Partial-Tib-Red-Alert

Quote:
Electronic Arts just announced they will be open-sourcing portions of Command and Conquer Tiberian Dawn and Red Alert...

...EA is to open-source TiberianDawn.dll and RedAlert.dll under the GPLv3 license. EA isn't providing the games as full open-source nor their assets but in this limited step they are aiming to help in allowing the community to create new maps, units, enhance the gameplay logic, and make other engine-level modifications.


So I guess we are still stuck with the OpenRA game engine then and all those slow SDL dependencies?

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 11:55:49
#123 ]
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Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@Mr_Capehill

Work is ongoing to make standalone versions:
https://github.com/jmarshall23/CnC_Remastered_Collection

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 12:12:36
#124 ]
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Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

As far as I can see this chap on GitHub is working on compiling DLLs from the source code that are compatible with the C&C Remastered engine! So it is still rather a modding project rather than a possible porting endeavour IMHO!

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 13:38:26
#125 ]
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Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

You should take a better look then. Justin Marshall is working on creating standalone versions from the DLL sources, that use the original assets.

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 17:10:05
#126 ]
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Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

Ok, so we're hoping he provides this perfected standalone engine incorporating EA's DLLs as an Open Source code base that can then be ported to AmigaOS?

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 20:38:45
#127 ]
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Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

I'm not sure what you mean by perfected, but an SDL port of RA and C&C should be easy enough to port NG at least.

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 21:10:49
#128 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

A non-SDL version for high end classics was what a lot of us are after! I thought the recent EA news was the ticket! This limited open source upload is worse than if no open sourcing of anything was going to happen. EA seem to promise the world and then we're stuck with OpenRA and or this GitHub chaps SDL version which will run far too slowly on even a 060 RTG Amiga!

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 21:23:05
#129 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12191
From: Norway

@BigD

Well as long as it does not do bit shifting for pixel plotting routine, it should be too horrible, considering SDL contexts are just memory blocks reserved by SDL or done by Exec there should be big issue, SDL has a concept of hardware and software context should also allow you draw pixels into fast memory, this should give great benefit, dealing with slow Zorro slot, copying over data over Zorro slot is biggest bottle neck, I have noticed that people that are the least happy about AmigaOS4.1 classic is mediator owners, while BizzardVisonPPC owner are really happy, so I guess the zorro slot is to blame, but you can drop frame rate down, so its not a big issue.

I guess what Im saying, is maybe your expecting too much from so old hardware.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Jun-2020 at 09:31 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Jun-2020 at 09:28 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 4-Jun-2020 22:54:52
#130 ]
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Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:
I guess what Im saying, is maybe your expecting too much from so old hardware.


In the mid to late 90s it was totally feasible that a 060 based Amiga with RTG could have handled Red Alert. The market didn't support a port but technically a native version WOULD have run fast enough. Doom / Duke Nukem 3D etc have been open sourced decades ago and impressive ports were produced. There is no reason that 25 years on EA couldn't allow the Amiga to finally get its own native 68k version!

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 7:15:31
#131 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

What stops people from replacing SDL with native code, and make 68k ports, like they did with countless other open source games? Why do you keep deriding Justin Marshall's effort, now calling it "limited"? How does even EA comes to the picture, did they promise a classic Amiga port?

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NovaCoder 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 7:29:01
#132 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2008
Posts: 487
From: Melbourne (Australia)

@BSzili

Quote:

BSzili wrote:
@BigD

What stops people from replacing SDL with native code, and make 68k ports, like they did with countless other open source games?


There really isn't any reason to replace the SDL with native code my friend, even AGA has a fast SDL implementation these days....well I say these days, I mean for the past 7 years ;)

Wolf

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 7:34:53
#133 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@NovaCoder

I know, but BigD seems to be hell bent on claiming that EA releasing the source code is somehow worse than C&C and RA remaining closed source. What's more, recreating the stand alone standalone executables is either not happening, or "limited' because it uses SDL

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 8:33:44
#134 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

Fine, my understanding of what's possible seems incomplete. If we can use GitHub guy's DLL standalone executables with a less buggy SDL implementation (I guess that would still require me to upgrade from FFS?) then great. I am just disappointed because I thought EA were open sourcing the whole game engine.

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 8:54:25
#135 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

I can't believe you are still pushing the DLL bit On second thought, I'm starting to get it now. I guess it's my fault for taking the bait when you first replied to me

Last edited by BSzili on 05-Jun-2020 at 08:54 AM.

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 9:14:59
#136 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

I'm pushing that bit because the DLL files are the only bit of the game engine that has been open sourced. Again I am not claiming to know in detail how C&C is constructed but this is a limited open sourcing of inner game workings/unit behaviour etc to help modders and not necessarily to help with porting. Anything can be reverse engineered but it just another barrier to an Amiga port that EA didn't go the whole hog!

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 9:19:03
#137 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

I'm guessing the DLL elements work a little bit like Doom's WAD files so EA are enabling the equivalent of user created WADs for Doom. However, the engine itself is under lock and key

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 10:09:11
#138 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

Dunning-Krueger effect at its finest

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BigD 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 12:43:52
#139 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 6396
From: UK

@BSzili

I've already admitted I have limited understanding of how a SDL version of Red Alert could progress given the open sourcing of the DLL game engine components. You obviously think it is easy and that EA have given developers all they need to pick up where OpenRA left off. Great! Thanks for explaining but a little less passive aggressive attitude would be nice. Not all of us can port an SDL version ourselves. Sorry. Perfectly aware of my limitations in coding and understanding coding.

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BSzili 
Re: Open RedAlert!!
Posted on 5-Jun-2020 13:09:05
#140 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 431
From: Unknown

@BigD

Please, stop. You are killing me!

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