@Hyperionmp

Quote:

Hyperionmp wrote: If you look at the roadmap of Freescale and IBM, ...

As long as you want to produce a router or web server with a good scaling SMP OS like Linux they might be a good choice. As long as you can't get boards with a 3GHz CPU on it they are ... worthless for desktops.

Currently Freescale starts using their ARM chips for automotive systems what a pitty a 1.6 GHz single core Efika / Sam might have been a nice desktop replacement.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@Hondo

Quote:

Hondo wrote: @WolfToTheMoon Why is it you're here on aw.net constantly making sure we know that PPC is dead ???

Maybe because it smells like it died long ago

Quote:

Do you see any OS4 users harrasing CUSA forums with x86 is dead posts all the time ??

No, because thanks to Apple, most former OS4 users updated to OS5.

Quote:

You should quietly leave this forum to the people who belives in the path hyperion has chosen for AOS

AFAIK this thread is posted under: " Amiga Q&A /  Free for All /  Emulation /  Gaming /  " No AmigaOS4 or Hyperion restricted area ... sorry maybe you had problems reading it.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

Quote:

The multicore support design for AmigaOS allows support of all of these features over time starting in AmigaOS 4.2.

oh, nice, since it was posted in "present" i assume the multicore is already supported, just not yet finished, or was it meant as "will support, sometime when os4.2 is done?"

Last edited by wawa on 05-Mar-2012 at 08:30 PM.

@Arko

12 cores + hyperthreading + max clock of 2.5Ghz.

What you need 3Ghz for? To generate 125W heat??

btw. Next wii is going to have 3Ghz quadcore 467 based chip, unless I'm mistaken.

And repost of some of my spam:
QorIQ AMP series T4240 seem to already be available for HW builders in alpha form.
I hope the mass production also starts in reasonable time frame.

SPAM:
HW playground1
Old article.
HW playground2
highest-ever-coremark
Advanced look to AMP...
"The company is planning to offer the AMP series in a broad array of configurations (T1 to T5), from ultra-low-power single-core products up to highly advanced SoCs targeting applications in networking, robotics, storage, medical, video systems and military/aerospace."

Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Mar-2012 at 09:18 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Mar-2012 at 09:05 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Mar-2012 at 09:02 PM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: @Arko 12 cores + hyperthreading + max clock of 2.5Ghz. What you need 3Ghz for? To generate 125W heat??

It's not about CPUs or cores or GHz. It is about selling the
same ole stuff over, and over again with advertizing telling
you how happy you will be. In the run of the mill commodity
hardware computer market the manufactures best friend has
always been micro$oft. It's about bucks, not CPUs.

@Mechanic

Quote:

It's not about CPUs or cores or GHz. It is about selling the same ole stuff over, and over again with advertizing telling you how happy you will be. In the run of the mill commodity hardware computer market the manufactures best friend has always been micro$oft.

Your words are harsh, but oh so true, I fear.

Quote:

It's about bucks, not CPUs.

Thank you for putting us with our feet back to the ground. One is so easily carried away nowadays.

OldFart

EIDT: Spellingmistakes

Last edited by OldFart on 05-Mar-2012 at 09:36 PM.

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

@Toaks

Thanks. To agree with you indeed 21:9 (2560x1080p) sets do exist. It'll be interesting to see if they catch on. Afterall 3D was a huge hope for the industry and it hasn't driven sales the way the manufacturers have hoped. We see videocards today that do 2560x1600 and even 4096x2160 so really a bit less for a console in 2 years should be possible. The TV sets aren't keeping up with the videocards.

Microsoft Research has a video on You Tube showing how to they use Kinect like user detection to beam two streams of 3D video out of a set to two different users. Each had their own 3D image of different items. Very cool.

I do wish people would use the words "lose" and "loose" properly.

"Lose" is a verb - to lose something means to not have it any more, it is gone. It is pronounced "looz".
"Loose" is an adjective - if something is loose, it is not tied down. It is pronounced "looce".

_________________
cheers
tony

Hyperion Support Forum: http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php

For me, this is less about whether PowerPC is going down and x86 is going up. Do the geniuses at Freescale come up with some cool tech? You bet. But I know that I am among a relatively small cadre of geeks that appreciate what is being done within those labs, to the rest of the world it means next to nothing.

The key thing to take away from this particular rumour is the reality that for a lot of systems the CPU architecture means very little. They can shift from MIPS to ARM, from x86 to PPC, and from PPC to x86. Their operating systems are less CPU logic dependant. Object oriented OS design and mature frameworks and API's allow them to make the devices that cater to the experience their users are keen on, and the returns their shareholders bought into.

How many XBox console users lamented the move to PPC? The PS Vita (ARM) can play all of the PSP (MIPS) games. No one cares what the CPU architecture is as long as the experience is uninterrupted.

Again, some of the best microprocessor architecture is being implemented by the PowerPC camp, but without the surrounding ecosystem to create experiences atop of, it is all sadly a little moot.

P.S. To all the hold-outs, I believe that as long as Ben Hermans' ego is involved with AmigaOS, it will never be ported away from PowerPC.

_________________
All the way, with 68k

@KimmoK

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: @Arko 12 cores + hyperthreading + max clock of 2.5Ghz. What you need 3Ghz for? To generate 125W heat??

As long as you can't get boards with a 3GHz CPU on it they are ... worthless for desktops

Quote:

btw. Next wii is going to have 3Ghz quadcore 467 based chip, unless I'm mistaken.

Wii predecessor the Game Cube had a PPC, it was well documented and available in that period before the Sam440 where introduced no hardware for AOS4 was available, but there was no AOS4 for it exactly as with the PS3.

Just because there is a PPC doesn't mean the plattform, the board or the CPU will be available for AOS4.

Last edited by Arko on 05-Mar-2012 at 11:43 PM.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@rzookol

Quote:

rzookol wrote: @Hyperionmp I don't want slow PPC chip taking 25W. I want fast (faster than G5 2.5-2.7 GHz). I don't want faster memory bus like in Sams where CPU is too slow to get more MB/s than in PegG4 Amigans don't need better CPUs, they need faster CPUs, anything new, which speed is below old G5 is not acceptable.

For what? What software that runs on AmigaOS4.x needs a CPU that is faster than a 2.5GHz to 2.7GHz G5?

Blender? AmiCygnix? Timberwolf? Something else?

OS4.1.5 needs better video card drivers probably more than anything else right now. (plus finished drivers for all components on the X1000's Nemo2 motherboard and every component on all of the SAM models), plus tookits to use the SAM's FPGA (this might be done already, but I don't know about it) and a toolkit for the X1000's XMOS chip)

As long as the next PPC chip is produced for general use in millions of electronic projects which use an embedded PPC chip, so the price and availability of this new PPC is low and anyone can buy it at many different distributors, and it has Altivec, I am sure it will be a good candidate as the successor to the PA6T used in the X1000. The challenge is keeping design and production costs down, so that the successor to the X1000 can be sold at a price that is much lower, and more acceptable to thousands of Amiga users. If A-Eon, or Hyperion, or ACube, can design a next AmigaOne computer that has at least as much computing power as the X1000, but at a price closer to what the SAM systems are currently selling for, I think a lot of Amiga users will jump on board and buy one.

Edit: @rzookol,

I do agree with one thing that you might be trying to say in your post. I agree that if anyone making hardware to run OS4.x on can't make a new design that is at least as fast as the used G5 Apple hardware, at a reasonable price, they probably should rethink their plan and just do a port to the Apple G5 hardware, which can be purchased for about $200 to $500, depending on model and where you are located. The 2.5GHz & 2.7GHz G5 PowerMac's are seriously faster computers, when compared to anything else that OS4.x runs on today. I would love to run OS4.2.x on my dual 2.7GHz G5 PowerMac some time in the future. I am sure that many Amiga users that want to run OS4.x on faster hardware would join me in applauding Hyperion for porting OS4.x to cheap, readily available, and very powerful Apple G5 PowerMac hardware.

So, anyone designing new hardware to run OS4.x on, should use the top of the line G5 hardware from Apple as a measuring stick for price and performance and if they can't beat the performance figures substantially, then they should not expect people to pay 5 to 10 times the price, for similar or lower performance, from a new OS4.x system. If they can only provide about the same performance when compared to the 2.7GHz G5, they should not expect to price a new system at more than maybe double the prices for the used computer systems.

That is my 2 cents

Edit: #2

Is hyperionmp a member of the Hyperion company? If yes, can you tell us if OS4.2 is expected some time this year, or is it more of a long range goal that will probably not arrive until some time next year, or even the following year? I can imagine that providing the features that have been announced as part of OS4.2, is a monumental task, so it is understandable if it takes more time. Specially when there are so many other tasks that need to be scheduled for the OS4.x developers to complete.

Last edited by amigadave on 06-Mar-2012 at 12:33 AM.
Last edited by amigadave on 06-Mar-2012 at 12:30 AM.
Last edited by amigadave on 06-Mar-2012 at 12:25 AM.

_________________
Amiga! The computer that inspired so many, to accomplish so much, but has ended up in the hands of . . . . . . . . . .

@AmigaBlitter

That author has written many stories on the PS3 and his accuracy level was near 0%.

I'd say it's a possibility but I'd take it with a big pinch of salt.

_________________
Whyzzat?

@vox

Quote:

vox wrote: @AmigaBlitter Title is misleading, as last Wii U uses PowerPC (and that is latest currently avail console). No surprise those who commit to AMD (ATI) graphic solution will utilize its CPU+GPU integration and consoles should be brave to exploit it. nVIDIA has ARM + GFX solution, but yet AMD is chosen. This proves that purchase of ATI was a great step forward for AMD. We can just envy they don`t have PowerPC licence

AMD's deal with Motrola's copper interconnects has restricted AMD from designing PowerPC compatible processors.

nVIDIA may have ARM + GFX solution, but they have less experience at designing "fat" out-of-order CPU cores compared to AMD.

PS; AMD GCN (Graphics Core Next) already includes X86-64/AMD64 IP.

Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 02:41 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 02:40 AM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@agami

Quote:

How many XBox console users lamented the move to PPC? The PS Vita (ARM) can play all of the PSP (MIPS) games. No one cares what the CPU architecture is as long as the experience is uninterrupted.

IMO those Xbox users afraid of the move to PowerPC didn't realize Microsoft's history with PowerPC. Windows NT supported not only X86 and Itanium. In the past it's supported MIPS, Alpha, and PowerPC. The Xbox and Xbox360 kernel is based off of NT. And certainly part of the reason for the reduced caring about CPU architecture is not only the modulatrity of the OS but the speed of the processors themselves.

@clusteruk

Quote:

clusteruk wrote: I think that Arm is well placed for the future especially as it has transitioned into multi core with multi core gpu's. Low power is a big deal, look at the new Arm powered servers coming on line, that is crucial to the cost of running cliud datacentres. Intel will be seriously concerned for the future, but x86 is around for a long time still.

Both AMD and Intel are developing low power server chips e.g. AMD has acquired SeaMicro i.e. a micro-server solution vendor.

AMD plans to use SeaMicro's ecosystem IP for AMD's OEM partners.

Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 03:09 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 02:57 AM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:

AmigaBlitter wrote: http://semiaccurate.com/2012/03/02/sony-playstation-4-will-be-an-x86-cpu-with-an-amd-gpu/ Rumors after rumors talks about AMD is the next big deal in the console CPU/GPU/APU What you think about? What for the future of PowerPC?

http://n4g.com/news/732111/amd-sees-merger-viable-option-for-ps4-and-xbox-720/com

AMD sees merger viable option for PS4 and Xbox 720.

PCH: "Neal Robison, Head of Software at AMD Developer Relations Department stated in an interview with the Xbit Labs on record that he believes a merger-APU as a basis for a powerful next-generation consoles to be useful, will be more powerful than you can imagine."

Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 03:03 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 06-Mar-2012 at 03:02 AM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@minator

Quote:

minator wrote: @AmigaBlitter That author has written many stories on the PS3 and his accuracy level was near 0%. I'd say it's a possibility but I'd take it with a big pinch of salt.

One problem, AMD GCN already includes X86-64 IP.

AMD has two fusion fronts i.e. GPU side (Radeon/Red team) and CPU side(AMD64/Green team).

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:

What you think about? What for the future of PowerPC?

It is not relevant to us. Current consoles using IBM chips havent contributed to our smaller-than-niche market at all.

_________________
Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@agami

Quote:

For me, this is less about whether PowerPC is going down and x86 is going up. Do the geniuses at Freescale come up with some cool tech?

Probably! The powerPC desktop market is today represented by some (old) linux distro and by a small AmigaOS market. In this i see an opportunity if the management can find/do some sort of agreement with the powerPC producer. As you can see AmigaOS can perform very well on x1000 and AmigaOne 500. Just imagine Amiga OS 4.2 with a quad PPC as soon as Multicore suppor will be added.

I'm convinced also that a strategy ( a clear strategy) should be defined to address the market problem.

_________________
retired

@Arko

You need a reality check.

Isn't macmini a desktop HW?
All mac minis run below 3Ghz, worthless for desktop?

Same for every Apple iMac 21.5".
Same for every MacPro, all below 3Ghz, all worthless for dekstop.

Look at this:
Mac Pro two 6-core Intel Xeon "Westmere" 2.66 GHz (12-core) 64Gb - 7795eur!!! WORTHLESS!

According to your brain, imac27" is the only Mac that is worthwhile for desktop?

Also for other mainstream desktop products, a lot of them are worthless for desktop...

Last edited by KimmoK on 06-Mar-2012 at 09:33 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?