@Hyperion-Director

Quote:

Hyperion-Director wrote: I realize this may take a while but I suggest we just wait for the Court to rule.

If that's what you want to do ... so be it ... bring it on.

Looks like another example of going whining to daddy, erm, the judge, because we have been so mean and unfair to you ... and because you're not capable of conflict resolution ... it gets pathetic.

So if you wanted to sound tough and menacing and what not ... you failed.
Miserably.
Spectacularly.
Again.

Last edited by jorit2 on 20-Apr-2021 at 02:12 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 20-Apr-2021 at 02:12 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 20-Apr-2021 at 02:05 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 20-Apr-2021 at 01:47 PM.

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@best buds

As today's assigned referee, I just want to remind you both of the rules:

I want a clean fight. No heeling, rabbit punching, gouging, elbows,...

Now touch gloves and please go to your corners.

#6

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@michalsc

Quote:

If you want to recompile, no change is necessary.

Of course not.
On ARM constans, offsets are compiled in little endian mode with instructions,
and stay in little endian format after switch to big endian.
Which require changes in C code.
On PPC everything data and code is in big endian mode.
No changes in C code are not need. Just recompilation.

Quote:

ARM running in big endian mode behaves just like big endian CPU.

The ARM running in big endian mode behaves differently compared to real big endian CPU.

Quote:

Of course you are wrong.

Of course I'm right and You lie about ARM compatibility problems in big endian mode.

@Hyperion-Director

Quote:

Hyperion-Director wrote: I realize this may take a while but I suggest we just wait for the Court to rule. Last edited by Hyperion-Director on 20-Apr-2021 at 01:11 PM. Last edited by Hyperion-Director on 20-Apr-2021 at 01:05 PM.

This post originated as:

Quote:

Hyperion-Director wrote: Seems the usual suicidal people are back.

Communication is hard.
Are you sure this PR-leg in Hyperion is something for you ?

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@ppcamiga1

Quote:

Of course not. On ARM constans, offsets are compiled in little endian mode with instructions, and stay in little endian format after switch to big endian.

A small example. The following two instructions load 32-bit constant into register:

movz w1, #0xbeef
movk w1, #0xdead, lsl #16

After these two are executed register w1 contains the value 0xdeadbeef. Followed with a store instruction:

str w1, [x0]

which will save the 0xdeadbeef 32-bit word at address given in register x0.

Now, the instruction stream for this three instructions is: a1 d5 9b 52 e1 dd b7 72 01 00 00 b9
Since in big endian mode the instructions are still stored in LE byte order in memory, the very same code can be executed in both modes of AArch64 cpu:

1. When ARM cpu is running in little endian mode, the register W1 will contain 32-bit word 0xdeadbeef. The memory pointed by register X0 will contain following bytes: ef be ad de, which correspond to the W1 value written as LE.

2. When ARM cpu is running in big endian mode, the register W1 will contain 32-bit word 0xdeadbeef. The memory pointed by register X0 will contain following bytes: de ad be ef, which correspond to the W1 value written as BE.

Now, tell me where the problem with recompilation or code modification occurs.

Quote:

Of course I'm right

Because you say so?

Quote:

and You lie

There is no reason to insult me.

@Hyperion-Director

Again I’m asking. Why do you come to this forum?

Is it some kind of strategical move?

To show the court some activity for the amiga community?

Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me what you are doing

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Could you tech wiz's please take the ARM discussion into a new thread please?

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@Birbo

Quote:

Again I’m asking. Why do you come to this forum?

For pity points!

Amigaworld is prolly last place left where you have people that are gullible enough to take anything that he says with face value.

@Hondo

I'm kind of liking it. We have this developing food fight interleaved with a technical discussion of endianess. The juxtaposition is striking. If we could get a programming language flame war started as well, it would be perfect.

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@Hondo

Quote:

Could you tech wiz's please take the ARM discussion into a new thread please

Sorry for that :)

@Hyperion-Director

See you dropped your ghastly suicide post. Talk about shooting from the hip. If you are a real solicitor I hope you apply better ethics for your clients. Perhaps you use this as your shouty place Ben but there are real human beings here.

Must be another quiet moment in the office - I guess there is lots of them considering how broke and how little product is available from Hyperion. Why don't you give all the delusional grandeur up, buy a few Amiga 500s off eBay and join in with us proles. With insensitive language like yours, you will fit right in with the more extreme of us.

Keep posting Ben, its a real insight into the leader of what many have become to know as their true path back to Amiga greatness - this is the guy you have put all your chips on folks.

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@bison

It is brilliant - not sure if the technical discussion is relief from the banter or the banter is relief for the technical talk. Its like to stars colliding. Popcorn ready, bring on the black hole!

Quote:

bison wrote: @Hondo I'm kind of liking it. We have this developing food fight interleaved with a technical discussion of endianess. The juxtaposition is striking. If we could get a programming language flame war started as well, it would be perfect.

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@bison

Quote:

If we could get a programming language flame war started as well, it would be perfect.

Happy to oblige. C sucks; use Ada.

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@A1200

Quote:

A1200 wrote: @Hyperion-Director Perhaps you use this as your shouty place Ben but there are real human beings here.

But you have to admit that the tone is not very friendly for Ben here. I don't´want to discuss, if he deserves the tone or not but I can understand that someones reaction is harsh when he is constantly attacked from other posters here. Maybe not professional but understandable.

It's also not a very good style (and illegal without permission as far as I know) to make private Email-conversations public.

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@simplex

Quote:

Happy to oblige. C sucks; use Ada.

In Rust we trust! :)

@michalsc

Quote:

In Rust we trust! :)

Rust: the people used by language who want to make C a "safe" language, but haven't heard of Ada.

Somewhat more seriously: Ada had a version of pointer safety long before Rust was a twinkle in Mozilla's eye. I'll grant though that it isn't as robust as Rust's ownership approach. On the other hand, Ada/SPARK has adapted Rust's approach into its philosophy of provable correctness, so hey, there's no need to settle for second-best.

(Well, on the Amiga you have neither Ada nor Rust, so you have to settle for languages that consider bugs to be features, which brings us back to C...)

Last edited by simplex on 20-Apr-2021 at 07:31 PM.

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@bison

Yeah I get your point...it is actually quite funny in it's own weird and arbitrary way

Last edited by Hondo on 20-Apr-2021 at 07:38 PM.

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@simplex

Quote:

Happy to oblige. C sucks; use Ada.

As someone who has nearly memorized appendix A of the K&R book (including the grammar), I can't really go along with that.

I don't know enough about Ada to have an opinion. I had to write a program in Ada at university twenty-some years ago, and I'm sure I did a bad job of it.

@michalsc

It was only a matter of time before someone played the Rust card. You should have suggested how everything would be so much better if AROS were entirely rewritten in Rust.

Last edited by bison on 20-Apr-2021 at 07:52 PM.
Last edited by bison on 20-Apr-2021 at 07:51 PM.
Last edited by bison on 20-Apr-2021 at 07:50 PM.

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@AP

Or maybe he's just treated like asshole because he is an asshole?

@bison

Quote:

As someone who has nearly memorized appendix A of the K&R book (including the grammar)...

Hey, I taught myself C from the K&R book. I remember using C back when you declared a function argument's types in K&R style instead of ANSI style.

Quote:

I don't know enough about Ada to have an opinion.

I salute you, sir. Too few people are willing to say, "I don't know enough about X to have an opinion," especially on the internet. To wit, the entire "Cloanto acquire Amiga Inc Trademark" thread.

However, I do know enough about C to have an opinion. For instance, I once spent 2 weeks trying to debug a program that worked fine at the -O0 optimization level and crashed horribly whenever I selected -O1 or higher. It turned out that the error was the absence of a return statement in a function that was declared to return boolean. The compiler didn't utter so much as a peep, let alone halt and declare an error, because to the mind of C's designers, a function that declares that it returns boolean and fails to return anything at all is a feature, not a bug.

Some computer languages come with explicit warnings not to use them in critical situations. Java used to, though I haven't checked lately. K&R declined to submit C to the competition that resulted in Ada, admitting that it wasn't suitable for what the Department of Defense needed.

By contrast, Ada is almost certainly the programming language used in the last airplane you flew, the last train you rode, etc.

Game, set, match, people!

Last edited by simplex on 20-Apr-2021 at 09:45 PM.

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I've decided to follow an awful lot of people I respect and leave AmigaWorld. If for some reason you want to talk to me, it shouldn't take much effort to find me.