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cc3d 
Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 30-Jun-2020 0:00:42
#1 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

So I got the Amigakit IDE CF setup for my 4000.

Problem is, when it is connected tot he IDE bus, Amiga never gets past grey screen.

I have tried:

using either of my 2 IDE cables
setting IDE CF reader's jumper to various settings
The IDE CF reader with no card in it.

any clue why The A4000 won't boot when this is connected?

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Hypex 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 30-Jun-2020 17:55:51
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9935
From: Greensborough, Australia

@cc3d

Are using the older IDE cables or the new DMA ones? AFAIR I've only used the old 40 wire ones. The immediate thing that comes to mind is making sure the cable is connected correctly at both ends. And also that the adapter has power if it needs it.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 30-Jun-2020 20:41:56
#3 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@Hypex

Yea, I have tried both the old and new cable. I have checked and rechecked the connection. I am going to go through it again. It's odd as I can connect the native Amiga IDE drive (from1992) and everything works.

When I replace it with the IDE CF device (card inserted or not), the Amiga won't boot. Note that I have 2 IDE CF devices, one from AmigaKit and one other one. They both do the same thing.

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g01df1sh 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 30-Jun-2020 21:31:11
#4 ]
Super Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2009
Posts: 1675
From: UK

Do you just have the CF card connected to the ide interface?

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 30-Jun-2020 22:21:46
#5 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@g01df1sh

I have the power attached as well.

Last edited by cc3d on 01-Jul-2020 at 01:09 PM.

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Hypex 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 1-Jul-2020 16:45:50
#6 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9935
From: Greensborough, Australia

@cc3d

So by itself the cable is OK when connected but when an adapter is on the end it won't boot?

Does it try and boot off the floppy at all?

You wait for 30 seconds in case it can't locate IDE devices?

Can't get to the early startup menu?

Is the SD card formatted as anything yet?

Can't believe I thought of five questions.

Last edited by Hypex on 02-Jul-2020 at 03:48 AM.

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g01df1sh 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 1-Jul-2020 19:38:17
#7 ]
Super Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2009
Posts: 1675
From: UK

CF cards have no master slave option so if its on the same lead as anything else you will run into problems.

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evilFrog 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 1-Jul-2020 20:07:55
#8 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 20-Jan-2004
Posts: 347
From: UK

@g01df1sh

The cards donít, but the adapters sometimes do. Iíve got a few here with a jumper you can set for master/slave, and the rest are all hard-wired to master.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 1-Jul-2020 23:37:58
#9 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@evilFrog
@g01df1sh
@hypex

went back last night and tried every combo I could think of.

I have 2 different IDE CF Card devices, one from AmigaKit and another from Ireland.
Each have a master/slave jumper as I would expect.

I have tried my new IDE cable (single end) with no luck.
I have tried my older 2-end IDE cable, which I have proven works by connecting to my original 120MB A4000 drive.
I have put both IDE/CF devices on each position of this cable and in every configuration.

Most times the machine just won't go past the first grey screen.
I cannot get to the boot screen (both mouse buttons down) when the device(s) are connected.

This is the case with the CF card removed as well. This tells me something is going on with both devices or the A4000

Best case I get the "put in your workbench disk screen" and this is when I change the master/slave jumper is a way which makes the device(s) disappear from the IDE bus.

I don't know. I'm at my wit's end. AmigaKit is no help either, they never respond to me about anything.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 13:43:44
#10 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@cc3d

UPDATE:

So the issue discovered.

I have a Warp Engine with SCSI controller in this A4000. I disconnected the SCSI drive and the IDE bus started acting normal.

I'll need to figure how to get the SCSI back online at some point.

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evilFrog 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 15:14:32
#11 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 20-Jan-2004
Posts: 347
From: UK

@cc3d

Thatís really strange! If you have a spare SCSI drive for the WarpEngine, it might be worth checking if itís just one drive, or all drives that are a problem.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 16:15:31
#12 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@evilFrog

Good point, I do have a spare I will try. I am also having trouble getting any other IDE drive to show up with the IDE CF. Probably a jumper setting that I can figure out.

Question: This machine has video toaster 4000 software on it and I no longer have the VT4000 disks. Is it reasonable to expect I could copy the VT files to the CF and get it to work?

Last edited by cc3d on 02-Jul-2020 at 04:33 PM.

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evilFrog 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 17:01:12
#13 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 20-Jan-2004
Posts: 347
From: UK

@cc3d

Yeah, CF cards are supposed to implement the IDE spec. In practice, Iíve found them to be pretty variable. Later versions of Kickstart and proper Ďbrand name' cards seem to help out here - I have an A600 that point blank wouldnít touch anything CF unless it was a Kingston... until it got upgraded to 3.1.
If youíre going for a two-drive IDE setup, start with the CF on master, I expect thatís the default state in 99.99% of all normal uses with a digital camera, so probably where most of the testing got done.

As far as VT4000... I've never used it myself, so I canít say for sure. Iíd imagine it wouldnít be too hard; Iíve never met a program I couldnít reinstall by hand on an Amiga. The only thing to watch out for would be anything that it mightíve dropped into FONTS:, LIBS: etc. on your Workbench partition and any lines in S:user-startup. Youíd have to move those too, but thatís not so hard.

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kolla 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 17:10:03
#14 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1485
From: Trondheim, Norway

Just so itís mentioned - master should be in the end of the cable, and devices that donít have jumper acts as masters, though a few CF adapters also support cable-select (the cable tells which one is to be master) and hence can also work as slave device.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 17:35:51
#15 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@kolla

Thanks. Yea, it's slowly coming back to me. Man, we had a lot of things to manage back then. I'd forgotten about things like SCSI terminator blocks and IDE jumpers. We've come a long way

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 2-Jul-2020 22:17:42
#16 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@evilFrog

Thanks. I appreciate the support. I am going in to see if I can get things working.

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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 3-Jul-2020 3:25:55
#17 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

so I am still perplexed as to why this isn't working.

I have gone through every possible jumper-setting and device arrangement (M/S).

In each case with both the spinning drive and CF connected, I may get the Spinning drive to boot, or I may get the CF to boot, but in every case the non-booting drive does not show up as a device.



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cc3d 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 3-Jul-2020 3:59:48
#18 ]
Member
Joined: 2-Jun-2020
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

Okay, so I got the CF to boot with original IDE as slave drive. However there is no apparent evidence that the slave drive is there. If I go into HDTools and scan, the drive will show (ST3144A). I donít know how to make it show up as an accessible drive in workbench.

Note this CF is from Amigakit and has workbench 3.1.

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evilFrog 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 3-Jul-2020 13:35:08
#19 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 20-Jan-2004
Posts: 347
From: UK

@cc3d

Ah, now thatís ringing a bell, Iím pretty sure Iíve faced that one before.
The good news is this: If youíve got both drives showing up in HDToolbox, I think youíve already won.
I *think* you just need to tell the master drive that itís not the only drive on the chain so that it doesnít put a "donít search for more drives" flag in the RDB. Iím pretty sure just opening the master up in HDToolbox gets you a message that something has changed and you can just save from there.
If itís not that, then it might be a volume clash, e.g. two partitions defined as DH0. I seem to remember that the Amiga is smart enough to just append ".1", ".2", etc. to each one, though.

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Hypex 
Re: Amigakit IDE CF
Posted on 3-Jul-2020 17:59:26
#20 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9935
From: Greensborough, Australia

@cc3d

What actual ROM does your A4000 have? 3.1?

On old IDE cables I recall there may be a difference in how they are connected on the cable positions. I can't find a guide now despite seeing one on my phone a few days ago. But check this as UDMA cables go in particular spots.

https://www.easeus.com/resource/install-ide-hard-drive.htm

Have you got a guide to the ST3144A jumpers? Needs jumper for slave to be present.

https://stason.org/TULARC/pc/hard-drives-hdd/seagate/ST3144A-131MB-3-5-SL-IDE-AT.html

Last edited by Hypex on 03-Jul-2020 at 06:00 PM.

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