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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
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Poll : AmigaOS4 KVM/Emulation
I would get AmigaOS4 Forever Edition/check out emulation
I already run OS4 in Emulation
Intresting, see where this goes...
AmigaOS4 Hardware only!
Not intrested in Emulation
Not intrested in OS4
Pancakes!
 
PosterThread
pixie 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 16:44:33
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3104
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@geen_naam

Quote:
I've meant new powerpc hardware.

We are now in 2023 still picking dead platforms? At least Pistorm gives a good run for buck

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fishy_fis 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 16:49:37
#22 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2153
From: Australia

@Maijestro

Fantastic.
Thanks.

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amigang 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 20:39:18
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2005
Posts: 2014
From: Cheshire, England

@ geen_naam

Quote:
I've meant new powerpc hardware. The problem with such products that you mention is that they either make an appeal to childhood memories (a500mini) or connect to real classic hardware (pistorm).


I know, I was giving example of new hardware that are based on emulation.

Let’s say for example

PistormPPC and
AmigaOne x1000 mini

Both came out, pistorm could still be arm based just emulated ppc chip instead of 68K, so that classic users could have a way to get os4 classic again. I think that generate a lot of interest and new sales of os4.

Again if a new mini arm computer in a mini case that say shipped in a mini x1000 case and could run an emulated version of amigaos4 all setup ready to go, I think again it would likly sell well and generate new interest.

Now I do get your point on nostalgia makes the 68k product likly always more popular, there kinda nothing wrong with that. But the above products priced rightly and working well, would likly get some who never considered checking out os4 before, to check it , hopefully they enjoy it because it seem familia but also more powerful and can do some more modern stuff the classic can’t do. That how you could slowly rebuild a mini market. Is it perfect, like I said before No. but it might be better then nothing.

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Karlos 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 20:46:20
#24 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4359
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@amiga

PPC is a pain to emulate. Technically posting OS4 to 68K would be a lot easier given that it's mostly written in C.

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Matt3k 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 21:40:30
#25 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Feb-2004
Posts: 203
From: NY

A feature no one asked for on a dead OS very few care for anymore. Kinda reminds me of multiprocessor support for a computer you can't buy anymore, still not working. So let's start another thing to not finish...


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Matt3k 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 12-Oct-2023 22:51:50
#26 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Feb-2004
Posts: 203
From: NY

@agami
"In Amigaland, we'd prefer a new well funded player to enter the scene and take over from Hyperion, and inject new life into this slowly dying platform. But as that is less likely to happen as each year of "two more weeks" passes, the other way to free the mostly beloved OS from Hyperion's tyranny, is to go open source.
welcome."



Yeah, big funders really don't mean much sadly anymore. To me it would make the most sense to create a bounty to fund MorphOS to another platform. Software is where it's at, not the hardware and MorphOS is the only offering to have an almost complete solution. 3.19 was running on Classic PPC at Efika speeds, although I guess it likely won't be released. But it would be an interesting release. Bespoke hardware is a deadend and lots of options are on the table already, you only need a good OS, native tool set, and native applications...

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agami 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 13-Oct-2023 7:17:33
#27 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1620
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Matt3k

Quote:
Matt3k wrote:
@agami

Yeah, big funders really don't mean much sadly anymore. To me it would make the most sense to create a bounty to fund MorphOS to another platform. Software is where it's at, not the hardware and MorphOS is the only offering to have an almost complete solution... Bespoke hardware is a deadend and lots of options are on the table already, you only need a good OS, native tool set, and native applications...

I mostly agree with you, but since MorphOS is closed source I think the onus is on the MorphOS team to share their plans for the future of the platform, and then perhaps garner support to accelerate it via a bounty.

There's no point starting a bounty for porting MorphOS to Raspberry Pi 5 if the team is mostly working toward x86-64. It would be splitting focus and dividing already precious development resources. I say pick one direction and go all in.

I hope to hear about the future plans and progress for MorphOS before 2023 is done.

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Matt3k 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 13-Oct-2023 10:19:27
#28 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Feb-2004
Posts: 203
From: NY

@agami

Fair points, we at least can disagree on open source :). As long as they keep developing steady and I get what I want, I'm good. So far that has been the case for 20 some years and I have sent them money recently to fix up PolyOrga and was very pleased with the results. PolyOrga is another example of bespoke software that is well beyond anything on any Amiga flavor, nothing else is close.

You mentioned maybe 1000 AOS4 users, if user count is countable like many believe by reg number than MorphOS has over 6000 at this point. Small compared to linux, but in Amiga Land it is good.

The MorphOS Team never release anything until they are ready to avoid the 2 more weeks syndrome, so maybe we will or maybe not. I'm still good either way as long as they get to it someday. Knowing that 3.19 is being worked on is enough for me right now.

I know we both agree that software is where it's at, and that is the focus. PowerMacs may be old now, but they are still faster, available, and much cheaper that anything you can use to run AOS4. At some point if they released MorphOS to run on Classic, it would be a cool bridge as well...

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 13-Oct-2023 14:57:49
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9570
From: Unknown

@amigang

Promising! This is probably the last component I need to build a dedicated OS4 notebook. With 3D support, it could even replace nice Pegasos 2 in my possession.

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ppcamiga1 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 12:05:56
#30 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 721
From: Unknown

@geen_naam

For Me Amiga NG is Amiga I always dream in nineties.
Amiga NG is Amiga that Commodore made around 1999 if exist.
It feel like my old Amiga 1200 but 1000 times faster.
Has integration with old software.
Was faster than uae.
Has all things that was standard in Windows 98 times.
Like MMU, FPU, 3D at least Pentium speed.
And It was real no emulator.
But I'm advanced Amiga user.

People that stop at Amiga 500 may no like it.

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ppcamiga1 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 12:13:33
#31 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 721
From: Unknown

Emulator is emulator.
We already has fast reliable open source powerpc emulator made by professionals.
It is qemu. It is 20 years old.
And it is faster on rpi than emu68.
So no reason to switch to emulated 68k.
No reason to waste time and money on porting to 68k.
If I own Hyperion I will be just pay for virtio, mouse, keyboard, paula drivers
and sell Amiga Os 4.1 as is to pistorm users.




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pixie 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 13:25:15
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3104
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

We already has fast reliable open source powerpc emulator made by professionals.
It is qemu. It is 20 years old.
And it is faster on rpi than emu68.
So no reason to switch to emulated 68k.


Lol we're down on meds again aren't we?

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Matt3k 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 14:43:06
#33 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Feb-2004
Posts: 203
From: NY

I agree in that AmigaNG has become Amiga for me as well. Classic is used for fun and NG is used for work and entertainment.

I use it as my daily driver with dual screens on a PowerMac 2.5GHz PCIe and PowerBook 1.67 17 systems and they do a great job. For me the Amiga has become more about the software as the day of bespoke hardware that was mindblowing in Amiga Land is dead and gone sadly. We are asked to over pay for slow hardware that a simple PPC Mac would blow away at pennys on the dollar simply to reclaim losses at this point.

I remember when 2.0 came out and many who were used to 1.3 hated it because it didn't 'feel' like AmigaOS to them anymore, but after they got used to the mass amounts of changes it was enjoyed and adopted. That is how I see MorphOS, it took the best aspects of 2/3.x and took it to the next logical level. and made it useable and developable. They used MUI, Turboprint, and other core elements that were the right choice to build on.

Sadly stakeholders have just squandered everything when they should have just backed MorphOS in the 90's as it should have been instead of the madness that followed. That is where I would spend my money if I was Hyperion or other stakeholders, right into MorphOS as it really should have been done in the first place.

TBH, AOS4 has made just to many mistakes and will just continues to do so. I know many who left AOS4 and they will not be coming back from users to developers gone forever. Slow and steady with MorphOS won the OS race for NG Amiga and they kept the band together and got the job done for over 25 years with major amounts of updates and point releases. Where AOS4 had very very little OS/Toolset/productive app development and has chased creating hardware without finishing drivers, started multiprocessor for dead hardware and not finishing it, releasing hardware 4 times the estimate price many years later and again likely not to have all the drivers worked out, start yet another reboot of just the core OS to get away from a lawsuit, we can go on and on with the madness and pretend it will get there... But to what end? Reality is reality at the end of the day and seeing it what it is and making decisions on that as apposed to feelings from the 80's makes sense and will be the best outcome we can hope for.

Even it they get multiprocessor working, who will buy the hardware? They really should have seen this and invested in the OS/Tools/Great native apps, now it's too late. Hence why they just see it for what it is and invest in MorphOS and everyone wins.

Last edited by Matt3k on 14-Oct-2023 at 02:50 PM.

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ppcamiga1 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 15:55:16
#34 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 721
From: Unknown

@pixie

you don't like bitter truth about emulated 68k.
powerpc is still better.
Emulator is emulator.
We already has fast reliable open source powerpc emulator made by professionals.
It is qemu. It is 20 years old.
And it is faster on rpi than emu68.
So no reason to switch to emulated 68k.
No reason to waste time and money on porting to 68k.

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pixie 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 16:25:22
#35 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3104
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@ppcamiga1

Please don't make up things as you go... what is faster on rpi then em68k? It isn't faster then uae on x86 and you think that it would in arm? Emu68k speedwise is on par with winuae so exactly how would it be faster on arm? You don't make much sense...

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michalsc 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 16:32:17
#36 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 14-Jun-2005
Posts: 376
From: Germany

@pixie

Please do not feed that troll…

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fishy_fis 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 18:41:22
#37 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2153
From: Australia

@michalsc

What would the feasibility of getting emu68 running on something like a mister assuming there was an amiga core that it could be used with?
Im not actually asking you to do it, Ive just always wondered if in theory some sort of hybrid software emulation on the ARM cpu it contains for cpu and fpga for custom hardware solution could be possible with it?
Its something Id be willing to contribute towards a bounty for should money be an enticement though ;)

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Rob 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 19:25:32
#38 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 6334
From: S.Wales

@fishy_fis

There's been Minimigs with a DIP64 socket for a while and the PiStorm works with them.

https://www.minimig.ca

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pixie 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 14-Oct-2023 20:53:33
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3104
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@fishy_fis

I there's something like that already if my memory doesn't fail me

https://linuxjedi.co.uk/2022/04/20/pistorm-in-the-minimig/

Last edited by pixie on 14-Oct-2023 at 08:59 PM.

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pixie 
Re: AmigaOS4 KVM Edition? virtual gpu driver Picasso96 coming soon.
Posted on 15-Oct-2023 20:06:39
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3104
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@fishy_fis

You should check for Pistorm mini-itx

Amiwest 2023 Day 2

around 1:41:50

Quote:


- Very distant future: PiStorm mini-ITX

- Multiple FPGA chips with common 16/2 bit synchronous bus

- Amiga custom chips implemented in diffrent FPGA modules

- RaspberryPi CM4 as main controller.

-16 MB onboard memory

- Standard mini-ITX form factor

- Not even rough ETA estimation at the moment!

Last edited by pixie on 16-Oct-2023 at 03:41 PM.
Last edited by pixie on 15-Oct-2023 at 08:09 PM.

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