Sorry to ruin the fun, but the court case is according to all parties the final outcome of a long standing dispute. Both parties seem to accept that the dispute wil be settled in a court case by a judge/jury so there is little point in siding with any parties. I'm sure the outcome will be respected by both parties, and as a result the parties will have to adjust accordingly to whatever the outcome is. There is nothing stopping Hyperion and Amiga Inc. from further cooperation after the case is overwith.

We might look at evidence, speculate, use past public statements and try to put the blame, and find the bad guy, but as most of you see the issue is so complicated it would be naive to simply side with one party and blame the other party.

As most know, based on leaked documents, both parties have not fulfilled all of their responsibilities, and both parties seem to have a noble cause. Amiga Inc wants to protect its IP, doesn't matter what its future plans are, Hyperion wants to recoup its investments and seem to have a genuine interest in pushing the operative system forwards, and so might Amiga Inc.

It might be easier for people to trust Hyperion more than Amiga Inc. if you base yourself on actual products, and past public record, but then again, that doesn't really matter when one is to judge who is "right".

I'd say both are right, both have done "wrong" things, and both have accepted to resolve this in court. I suggest we users keep on doing what we know best; wait and see, play with our beloved computer, develop software, help eachother, be creative and have fun.

[Edit: dicuss -> discuss in title]

Last edited by nicomen on 03-May-2007 at 10:05 PM.

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Nicolas Mendoza

@nicomen

With you there. The TuneNet team have also decided to just get on with it regardless of what's happening too.

FuZion.

@nicomen

Well said, I too think we should wait and see what happens and agree both parties have done wrong and probably have not been as honest to us folks as thay make out.
As long as we get some good hardware sometime in the future I will stick with Amiga whether its runing OS4/5 or what ever is official. My hope is that OS4 will not just turn into another third party AmigaOS wannabe.

It cant be stopped, the witch hunt in the community has begun.

@FuZion

Quote:

With you there. The TuneNet team have also decided to just get on with it regardless of what's happening too.

Glad to hear that! Not that I doubted it for a second.

The spotUP team has also decided to 'get on with it regardless of what's happening' ;)

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@nicomen

I wish it were possible, but it is ridiculous under the circumstances to ignore the court case.

Without progress and stability since Commodore, there just ain't enough to do!

LOL ! That's my answer to all Amigan psychosis... amazing its applicability !

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@nicomen

You make Amiga sound very rational with the talk of being sure they will respect the judge's ruling.

I don't see that from previous rulings as its often described, also is it rational what is going on with this Kent, WA arena craziness? If you have millions to work with why not buy out Hyperion as a company lock stock and barrel and release OS 4 on SAM pronto and just be done with it? Then you can concentrate on this ordering hot dogs from your cell phone at the Kent Arena side of the market they want to pursue without a bunch of bad publicity.

There does not seem to be much bottom line business stuff going on, especially considering the resources at Amiga's disposal. Instead all this childish stuff. When will you be able to buy a stable machine running OS 4 new realstically proceeding with this case? And when is it finally too late for the OS to even make sense to a hobbyist? The ill-will alone generated in the community is worth making this go away if you have the money to do so, let alone the bad press for the other endeavors they want to do, like this new technology testing in Kent when the arena is built.

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@nicomen

This is all right and insightful, but there's no point in NOT discussing it, either. We here are the crowds on the streets of Amigaland, and the whole point of being here is to discuss what's being brought on the table by our heroes.

I didn't ask Amiga Inc. to cook up the Classic OS (aimless and damaging), I didn't ask Hyperion to take on this responsibility (wrong people for the job), and I'd be the last one asking Hyperion to do a job as lousy as they did.

Instead, I suggested at various occasions to drop that silly name and to seek an exit from this unworthy debacle. (Of course, I didn't know at that time that Hyperion were the debitors, I rather imagined it was the other way round.)

Birds of a feather flock together; it seems that Amiga Inc. and Hyperion were both idiots that once made up a nice couple, and now we're watching their divorce. So what, isn't that worth all the gossip that's imaginable on an Amiga forum? Aren't we supposed to discuss what's on TV, just because it's pointless?

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@nicomen

Everyone loves to talk about the weather, even when there's nothing you can do about it. Just human nature. Speculating the out come of things in Amigaland is the equivelant of other people doing suduku and crossword puzzels.... exercises a few brain cells, but in the end it was all just to kill a bit of time. Other platforms might be jealous, all they ever have to talk about is new releases and bug fixes



Plaz

@nicomen

The thing that gets me is some say "the dispute has been going on for a long time and many of us knew about it" but shouted FUD when someone else stated they felt the impending mess was coming. Why did they not tell us then. I feel they loose their credibility. Anybody that downplayed the fact that lawyers had been called in needs to rebuild their reputation.

@stew

I guess that's a common emotion in the Amiga community, the sense of being ignored when stating things that later turn out to be true. Actually sometimes it almost seems like a desase, each time a "told-you-so" moment comes by, people not being into Amigas for years get back on the boards and try to fulfill some crave of finally having right

Anyway, my point is still: It's not that important to be right, it's more important to have fun ;)

@oppressor

Ok, fine go on discussing, it's not like I wanted to ban discussion or speculation etc. it's more that I feel it's little point, and in the end it might create polarizations and divisions between groups and people.

Going on analyzing every statement, every move, will eventually lead to a subjective conclusion which vary from person to person, what one person might have said or done can be interpreted in two opposite ways easily, just because the persons experiencing it may have different backgrounds, different opinions, different information etc.

If one is in the heat of some discussion and swearing and hitting the keyboard when responsing to someone, one should take two steps back, try to get a wider perspective and maybe try to understand why the other person might have a different view than oneself. Most of us are more alike than we probably realize. We have about the same hopes, dreams, wants and interests regarding a platform that many of us have lived with for a decade or two.

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Nicolas Mendoza

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote: @nicomen You make Amiga sound very rational with the talk of being sure they will respect the judge's ruling.

Heh, good point.

The only way AI can get what they want though, is if the court gives it to them.

If they lose, Hyperion already has what they need, and AI won't even have access to the source.

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@nicomen

Sure, I agree with you completely as well as your intention that siding with one or the other is not an issue.

What the "goings on" in the Kent community have to do with anything surely beats me. If anybody here finds it strange or hyped they certainly have to make a reality check!

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@T_Bone

Quote:

The only way AI can get what they want though, is if the court gives it to them. If they lose, Hyperion already has what they need, and AI won't even have access to the source.

It's not at all clear that they "want" or "need" OS4.

What seems to be the main arguement is that Hyperion is using the the name and other trademarks that Amiga Inc. controls for a product that they don't.

Amiga Inc. seem to have their own objectives (haven't they even claimed to have an OS5 ready soon) and just don't want Hyperion upsetting those plans.

Just by getting their hands on OS4 source code would still leave them far from world domination.

This court case is more of a cease and desist and at the same a demand for what is rightfully theirs (in their opinion of course).

I hope nicoman is right and that both parts are just seeking clarification and that there might still hope of cooperation in the future.

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@nicomen

You must be kidding, what could possibly cause more polarization and division between groups than has been the case already? When the dust starts to settle, this is nothing less than a chance for a large part of this community to wake from its feverish dreams and aberrant sleepwalk.

Until then and for that purpose look at the court case, dissect it in utmost detail, and don't hold yourself back from drawing all sorts of unpleasant conclusions. I'm suggesting this because the Amiga scene was taken hostage by OS4 and its advocates; now that finally some hard evidence starts to show up, it's time to follow their struggle and analyze it as spectators, not as addressees of ommissions, half-truths, untruths, and faith-inducing babble.

There is something to learn from for life: about stubbornness, conceitedness, faith as a poisonous agent to reason. To stop barking up the OS4 tree is only the first step. OS4 was an ill-fated construction, conceived by people who were not able to sustain an enduring alliance. I think we can agree on the last part.

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@Oppressor

Quote:

Amiga scene was taken hostage by “OS4 and its advocates”

The “OS4 and its advocates” what’s left of the Amiga community every thing else is just clone market, and there has not been any progress in classic Amiga computer market for long time now, not that Amiga Inc, where not able to give other licence for other classic hardware.

Quote:

OS4 was an ill-fated construction

MorphOS was an ill-fated construction, AmigaOS4 is dream come true for me

All you do is write this stuff to start a flame war, I so typical Oppressor comments!

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-May-2007 at 09:35 AM.

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@Steff

I understand that, my comment was in reply to "You make Amiga sound very rational with the talk of being sure they will respect the judge's ruling."

How could they not comply? They really don't have any choice, as the things they seek from the court, they don't have access to otherwise.

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@nicomen

Quote:

nicomen wrote: Sorry to ruin the fun, but the court case is according to all parties the final outcome of a long standing dispute. Both parties seem to accept that the dispute wil be settled in a court case by a judge/jury so there is little point in siding with any parties. I'm sure the outcome will be respected by both parties, and as a result the parties will have to adjust accordingly to whatever the outcome is. There is nothing stopping Hyperion and Amiga Inc. from further cooperation after the case is overwith.

Good post. I was thinking about posting something along this same thing a couple of days ago. What I'm hoping is that the court case settles the differences and opens up a path for renegotiation for new partnership/contracts between both companies. Yes, it is possible to continue to work with a company after a lawsuit... They both need this to solve their differences, and without it, nobody is going anywhere.

I fully hope that Amiga/ACK are able to get control of OS4 so that they can move forward with the announced systems for "this summer". But at the same time, I want provisions for Hyperion/ACube to be able to move forward as well, and with a solution that will benefit everyone.

@nicomen

And there are far more interesting cases in the American legal system that put "ours" into perspective:

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/weird_news/7309851.html

People are strange.

@Benji

Of course it's pointless as the judges are certainly to be the last say. But, we're Amiga users it's our hobby and Amigaworld is a site named to attract the Amiga users. All of us pessimists and optimists gather to discuss what may be in the future to our favorite platform. Cuz you know that's what we do cuz we consider things Amiga important in various ways.