@MikeB

You could argue that it's too bad Halo never became what it was supposed to be too. I guess we'll see that realized at least partially in Halo Wars and perhaps in the as of yet untitled Halo project.

Saying they were the most promising is probably a bit of an understatement. They were pretty much the leading games development company on MacOS - unless you count Blizzard's excellent support.

But yeah, I too expect Halo 3 will surpass Gears of War very quickly since it's already an established franchise. The performance of Gears of War is quite amazing from a commercial point of view.

Quote:

MORE THAN A GAMES CONSOLE?

Terrasoft is now accepting PS3 pre-orders with YDL Linux pre-installed.

http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/store/index.php?submit=hardware&submiting[hardware][sony]=1

Also the YDL v5.0 DVD Set is now available for the PS3.

@ Trezzer

And they supported Playstation in the past as well. IMO a good example of degrading consumer choice...

@MikeB

Sort of how I now have to buy 5+ platforms to get SEGAs games? It's business.

@MikeB

Quote:

PS1. PS2 and PS3 titles combined greatly outnumber XBox + PC games/sales. I view the PC and XBox 360 as two different platorms, .

Why treat XBOX/PC differently to PS1/PS2/PS3?

From developer’s POV(via Visual Studio .NET IDE platform), PocketPC (Windows CE based), Windows 2K/XP/Vista and XBOX are all Microsoft Windows compatible platforms.

Quote:

so I won't combine the XBox and PC market as being one, they are competing with eachother.

"XBOX 360" doesn't compete against >50 percent of PC retail market i.e. laptops/notebooks.

Vista will forced PC vendors to smarten up PC’s shipping GPUs. Factor in Larrabee Development Group (Intel's GPU group).

Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:08 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 08:42 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 08:41 PM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@MikeB

Quote:

If they are two completely different markets they wouldn't compete at all. With the PS3 having good keyboard and mouse support, the console potentially penetrates a market segment traditionally owned by the PC and to a much smaller extend the Mac, and in a distant past, of course by the Amiga and Atari ST.

Lintel didn’t change MacOS X (X86/X64) uptake i.e. factors are Microsoft Office, Adobe and accounting/personal finance software.

Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 08:50 PM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @BrianK The Mac games market is already minuscule, I don't think the PS3 will make much of a difference in this regard. People generally don't buy Macs because of the games, however quite a few people did buy PCs because of the games (or internet usage, another interesting PS3 feature). Whole groups of people bought new or upgraded PCs just to play games like Doom, Quake and Half-life in their full glory.

In Microsoft style, Apple plans to leverage their iTune’s market power for iMacTV. There are rumors that Apple may release game/media/itunes centric platform.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@Hammer

Quote:

In Microsoft style, Apple plans to leverage their iTune’s market power for iMacTV. There are rumors that Apple may release game/media/itunes centric platform.

Microsoft style? Huh Microsof has a competitor to iTunes that'll leverage games? Isn't it the other way around? 360 will be used to leverage media, such as the first downloadable HD TV and HD movies. Of course Sony will be using their PS3 to leverage their DVD format - Blu-Ray, along with downloadable music content.

As for iMacTV games I can see them having downloadable MAME sorts of stuff. But, without a great videocard they will be stiffled if they expect to have PS3/360 graphics quality.

As for iTunes it appears Nov. was the first month that total songs sales have dipped. An interesting observation. It could be a temporary blip. It could be online music market has stalled.

@BrianK

Quote:

Microsoft style?

Refers to how a corporation leverages one of their strength and bring it to another market.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@BrianK

Quote:

As for iTunes it appears Nov. was the first month that total songs sales have dipped. An interesting observation. It could be a temporary blip. It could be online music market has stalled.

Factor in Nokia's on-line music business and smart phone platform. But Apple disputed Forrester's numbers.

Refer to http://www.macnewsworld.com/story/54733.html

"Piper Jaffray on Tuesday issued a report that showed Apple sold 18.5 million songs per week from January 2006 through September 2006, compared to 10.4 million songs per week during the same period in 2005"

Quote:

As for iMacTV games I can see them having downloadable MAME sorts of stuff. But, without a great videocard they will be stiffled if they expect to have PS3/360 graphics quality.

Apple could go XBOX 360 way for sourcing GPU i.e. atm AMDs’ R580/RV570 is dropping in price.

Both nVidia and AMD likes to sell more GpGPUs…

Without the use of mobile processors (e.g. Merom), 499 USD is an easy target to hit. There are rumours that Apple may use AMD processors (CPU/GpGPU system platform) in that regard. 65nm process node should reduce AMD’s supply constrains.

Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:37 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:33 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:28 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:23 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 15-Dec-2006 at 09:19 PM.

_________________
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@BrianK

Quote:

As for iTunes it appears Nov. was the first month that total songs sales have dipped. An interesting observation. It could be a temporary blip. It could be online music market has stalled.

Linky linky

@Hammer

Quote:

Why treat XBOX/PC differently to PS1/PS2/PS3?

It was just an example. Comparing sales for a brandnew product with platforms year(s) old does not make much sense.

But PS1/PS2/PS3 have more common ground as the new models are compatible with the old, just like new PCs may run older PC games, while new games may not run (well enough) on older PCs.

Quote:

From developer’s POV(via Visual Studio .NET IDE platform), PocketPC (Windows CE based), Windows 2K/XP/Vista and XBOX are all Microsoft Windows compatible platforms

From an enduser and retailer point of view they aren`t.

Last edited by MikeB on 15-Dec-2006 at 10:49 PM.

@Hammer

Quote:

"XBOX 360" doesn't compete against >50 percent of PC retail market i.e. laptops/notebooks.

But still the PC games market is slightly larger than the XBox games market. Of course laptops can play games too and with an external mouse aren't that bad for playing many different types of games. Still if you would combine both XBox (360) and Windows markets, it's still smaller than the whole Playstation-family games market.

Some latest news from a Sony Exec, the PS3 should be launched in Europe a bit earlier than previously planned: 3 March 2007

The new Eye-Toy should be available and be able to record with HD quality. A TV tuner should become available around this time as well adding Tivo features. The more polished Motorstorm worldwide release should be available late February/early March as well. New Java and Flash player downloads have been mentioned.

http://www.smashmyps3.com/
video: http://youtube.com/watch?v=cPk1tEyZGBE
http://www.smashmyxbox.com/
video: http://youtube.com/watch?v=anHkwBYH-bY
you decide!!!!!!!!!!!!

or the WII http://youtube.com/watch?v=Qr3wue0nec4

Last edited by mossup on 16-Dec-2006 at 04:50 AM.
Last edited by mossup on 16-Dec-2006 at 04:47 AM.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Hammer Quote: Why treat XBOX/PC differently to PS1/PS2/PS3? It was just an example. Comparing sales for a brandnew product with platforms year(s) old does not make much sense. But PS1/PS2/PS3 have more common ground as the new models are compatible with the old, just like new PCs may run older PC games, while new games may not run (well enough) on older PCs. Quote: From developer’s POV(via Visual Studio .NET IDE platform), PocketPC (Windows CE based), Windows 2K/XP/Vista and XBOX are all Microsoft Windows compatible platforms From an enduser and retailer point of view they aren`t.

Amusing how everyone else in the thread agrees that the ease of porting being a non-iussue between 360 and PC is good news for both the 360 and PC platforms, which Sony could/should learn from, except for you.

The fact remains if it's easy to port between two platforms, one effectively becomes 'nearly free,' making it MUCH more likely to see a retail version. No such thing exists for PS3, and this effectively combines the 360 + PC markets in PS3 exclusion, thus PC/360 exclusive.

YDL- looks liek what, a charge of $50 for YDL pre-install?

_________________
Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@wegster

Quote:

Amusing how everyone else in the thread agrees that the ease of porting being a non-iussue between 360 and PC is good news for both the 360 and PC platforms, which Sony could/should learn from, except for you.

Strange where did I state that? Yes I consider seamless binary compatibility being even better (like OS3=>OS4), but please don't make things up...

Playstation should die just like the Amiga?

http://tech.blorge.com/Structure:%20/2006/12/06/why-the-end-of-playstation-hardware-will-be-best-for-all/

"The Amiga was one of the best computers of the mid 1980s, but the problem was, if you bought an Amiga you couldn’t (easily) use PC software, or Mac software for that matter. In fact in those days there were dozens of different proprietary systems around. You bought the system and then you were stuck with having to buy software for that particular machine (sound familiar?). And guess what, all platforms except PC and Mac died because they never got to a critical mass."

They seem to have a different opinion on why Commodore went out of business, a different perspective on consumer choice, diversity and a different opinion on which platforms have more 'critical mass' within the gamig industry than I have.

@Trezzer

Quote:

Sort of how I now have to buy 5+ platforms to get SEGAs games? It's business.

Yes, but it's a bit sad regarding a company like Bungie Studios (it's not like they didn't already intend to support Microsoft products already amongst various othe solutions, which adds consumer choice and diversity). I think it would have been sad if Microsoft would have been allowed and able to buy Apple, Nintendo and Hyperion as well.

At least I won't buy more than one home game console, the PS3 seems to be the best choice considering its multi-functionalty (Tivo, Blu-Ray, Other OS, etc). Regarding SEGA, I am looking forward to their new Golden Axe game which should become available for both the XBox 360 and Playstation 3.

The amount of games I am interested in is now starting to become a bit overwhelming though, the more games I know about the more is added to my wishlist, Castlevania: Portrait of Ruin for the Nintendo DS and Devil May Cry 4 for the PS3 can now be added as well... Is the market skyrocketing or what? I will probably buy Halo 3 for the XBox 360 as well...

For the PC the last couple of years I was interested in only about 4 games a year and I don't consider myself a hardcore gamer.

Last edited by MikeB on 16-Dec-2006 at 11:03 AM.
Last edited by MikeB on 16-Dec-2006 at 10:57 AM.

@Trezzer

Quote:

Briank Wrote: Quote: As for iTunes it appears Nov. was the first month that total songs sales have dipped. An interesting observation. It could be a temporary blip. It could be online music market has stalled. Linky linky

It appears Forrestor's article and the feedback on the article are looking at the data in different ways. For example the link you provided compares Nov 05 to Nov 06 - a clear gain. Forrestor compares month to month within the year. It seems Jan was the high and downloads per month. June 06 sales were down 65% from Jan 06, for example. It appears iTunes have a market seasonality.

@Mike B
Quote:

PS3 seems to be the best choice considering its multi-functionalty (Tivo, Blu-Ray, Other OS, etc).

I don't agree it's screaming best. It's a good choice. The 360 does all that, in a bit different ways, except for alternative OS.

As for Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD. One telling item of the VHS vs Beta was the Porn Industry, who ships more DVD today then Hollywood, went with VHS because it was lower cost to the consumer and lower cost to manufacture. The PI is now backing HD-DVD due to Blu-Ray manufacture costs. The first porn HD porn in japan was HD-DVD. When I see analysis of these 2 formats it seems the PI is not mentioned. It well may have an influence again.

One thing both consoles are currently missing is a good set of games for the highest set of PC gamers -- 30-40 year old women. They appear to really like the sudoku, scrabble, word whomp, solitare online games. LIVE is more compelling right now but I can see both the online services adding these sorts of games.

@BrianK

Quote:

The 360 does all that, in a bit different ways, except for alternative OS.

For me the PS3 is the best choice. Alt OS is a killer feature for me, I will probably upgrade the harddrive to 200 GB for recording and I look more forward to many of the games planned for the PS3, the only exception being Halo 3.

Quote:

One telling item of the VHS vs Beta was the Porn Industry, who ships more DVD today then Hollywood, went with VHS because it was lower cost to the consumer

For me porn is a non-issue, I am not looking for high definition porn. With the PS3 Blu-Ray players and content is already cheap enough. Surely there will be more content available than for Sony UMD, I would be the last to advocate DVD, HD-DVD or Blu-Ray to anyone to which UMD suits their needs. It's all just digital content.

Last edited by MikeB on 16-Dec-2006 at 08:17 PM.