@MikeB

It's not just Time Magazine that has been relatively negative towards PS3. Pretty much most major publications have - and for good reason.

You can think Resistance is better all you want. It may well be very good gameplay wise although reviews place it as merely "good". I haven't played it myself so will reserve judgment. The one thing I can tell from screenshots alone, though, is that it's far from as gorgeous as Gears of War - then again nothing is at the moment.

A fanboy posting on a forum doesn't really do much for perspective - especially one who just posted $1000 into getting a new console...

Anyway, regarding Virtua Fighter: Found out the reason why they're porting to PS3 is actually that it's slightly easier because the graphics chip is more or less the same. It still took a lot of work to move from x86 to Cell code, though, since the original CPU was a P4. Just a side note, but I found it interesting none the less. I'm guessing that means we'll have to wait for VF6 to see it on 360 (maybe).

@Trezzer

The video doesn't lie, just someone happy with his PS3 already and showing off some things he likes about the system. Many mainstream media reports seem a bit exaggerated and extreme, trying to make up "interesting" cover stories.

I seriously doubt we will ever see 1080p graphics like this on the 360 or Wii, or anything equivalent at lower resolutions. Gears looks very good, but this in terms of graphics is IMO beyond its leaque.
http://www.gametrailers.com/player.php?id=15813&type=wmv

@MikeB

Quote:

IMO Resistance is also a better game than Gears overall (I stick to my opinions no matter how many rewards Gears receives

I know I went over this already but you are comparing a FPS vs 3PS. They're similar but not in the same genre. Indiana Jones vs Star Wars -- both Harrison Ford films but one is a Sci-Fi epic and the other isn't. There's a loose relationship there but a direct comparision mostly fails as they aren't in the same genre.

Also you haven't clarified for us how many hours you've played with Resistance. Your local claims Europe where PS3s are not shipped yet. Are you really Europe? Where? Did you have someone import the PS3 for you?

Last edited by BrianK on 21-Dec-2006 at 02:42 PM.

@MikeB

Quote:

I seriously doubt we will ever see 1080p graphics like this on the 360 or Wii, or anything equivalent at lower resolutions. Gears looks very good, but this in terms of graphics is IMO beyond its leaque.

Dude, Gran Turismo HD isn't impressive by any measure - not for PS3 nor for 360. Just *look* at it.

@MikeB

Quote:

I seriously doubt we will ever see 1080p graphics like this on the 360 or Wii, or anything equivalent at lower resolutions

I believe the game is 720p not 1080p.

@BrianK

Gran Turismo HD is 1080p AFAIR.

The environments are bland to say the least though. The mountains look like high-res photographs rather than rendered to fit in with the scenery. The detail level is low.

The only good thing to say is that the car models are nice and the people on the side lines look pretty nice.

It's fairly telling that they're not showing you more than they are - by using camera motion and focus changing (which you won't be seeing in the game except for replays) the game appears more frantic. Just like the previous Gran Turismo games. While playing it it will merely look like the previous ones with slightly nicer textures and more polygons.

Why don't we see an in-c0ckpit (haha I'm being censored!) view with nicely rendered dashboard, subtle lighting effects through the windshield, shaking viewpoint from inside the c0ckpit and all that which adds to the immersion in a racing game instead of the same ol' same ol' ?

Good thing I didn't have to mention roosters as well...

Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 02:55 PM.
Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 02:55 PM.
Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 02:53 PM.

@ BrianK

I have played and seen Resistance and Gears of war be played for hours. I know PS3s haven't been officially released yet in Europe, but some people have them, needless to say there are over one hundred developers working here in the Netherlands to complete Killzone.

@ Trezzer

Quote:

he detail level is low.

I don't know what to say...

Quote:

Why don't we see an in-c0ckpit

Overview shows the cars better.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player.php?id=14531&type=wmv&pl=game

http://www.insidegamer.nl/playstation3/granturismohdconcept/videos/1126

Inside car view, actual end user gameplay:
http://www.gamespot.com/pages/video_player/popup.php?pid=928379&sid=6160297&tab=related&tag=videos;related;12

Last edited by MikeB on 21-Dec-2006 at 03:20 PM.

@Trezzer

Quote:

Gran Turismo HD is 1080p AFAIR.

Sorry yes I got lost there.

GTHD -- was that not cancelled? I believe there's 1 demo course w/ a dozen cars but the game will not be developed instead they'll work on Gran Turismo 5. Likely some concepts from HD will be included. I believe Oct-Nov is the GT5 ship date, 07 of course.


@MikeB

On the AV version of the PS3, may we call it the PSX2, some details have emerged - twice the memory, built in TV recording, HDMI. Sounds like it won't be an add-on to the current PS3 but another version of the PS3 itself. The PSX didn't make it maybe this time it'll be a charm. I believe the pricing was $2,500 US -- ouch! That's always subject to change. But, if they think that'll fly in the US they will be mistaken. Being they lose money on each console already adding on hardware will likely increase costs with little oppurtunity for recovery -- afterall this will be a higher priced console and come out later the demand will likely be less then the PS3 itself. It seems this plan will further sink Sony -- I bet it's scrapped or Japan only.

@MikeB

Quote:

Inside car view, actual end user gameplay:

Their movie playback isn't working for me. I tried to find other videos, but only found an above the road video, which looked just like the old Gran Turismos - just in higher resolution. Still the same toy physics and no next-gen lighting effects.

Quote:

I don't know what to say...

It seems that what impresses you more than anything else is resolution and draw distance. At least those are the two things that are decent in the video (besides the car models, but I already mentioned those). Other than that the game really just looks spectacularly unspectacular. Resolution aside it looks as "next-gen" as Gran Turismo 3.

@Trezzer

Quote:

I'm guessing that means we'll have to wait for VF6 to see it on 360 (maybe).

Oh, luckily I was proven wrong!

SEGA just announced that Virtua Fighter 5 is coming to 360 this summer.

@Trezzer

The Gran Turismo screens are very disappointing. Look at the textures here:

http://uk.media.ps3.ign.com/media/713/713809/img_3976551.html

That isn't motion blur, that's very poor detail. I'd expect better than that.

http://uk.media.ps3.ign.com/media/713/713809/img_3976551.html

Same again. The grass is no better than I'm seeing in Zelda right now. The mountains are initially impressive, but they're not very high-res either, and being the traditional racing-game mountains you never reach, are easy to map a simple texture onto. You can see there's not that many polygons involved.

Here's a nice one of Forza 2. The road is nicely detailed and if you add motion blur, you'll see a very different effect to the almost PS2-class textures in GTHD:

http://uk.media.xbox360.ign.com/media/743/743956/img_3949574.html

For good measure, here one of Gotham, which looks in a different league to GTHD:

http://uk.media.xbox360.ign.com/media/741/741362/img_3030700.html

Chris

Last edited by clebin on 21-Dec-2006 at 06:57 PM.
Last edited by clebin on 21-Dec-2006 at 06:55 PM.

@clebin

It's well worth noticing that Forza 2 has an extensive physics model as well - real damage on cars etc.

@Trezzer

Quote:

Splinter Cell: DA

Apparently a PS3 version will be available in time for the European launch. And yep good news regarding VF5 for XBox 360 fans, although I think this was somewhat expected regarding SEGA titles.

@MikeB

Ah, it should be an easy port too considering that it's already multi-platform (PS2, Xbox, 360).

I was still surprised about Virtua Fighter for 360 considering the thing about the graphics chip - and that Virtua Fighter 4 was PS2-exclusive. I guess it's worth the porting effort. Perhaps it'll look even better with the 360 GPU - it'll at least be interesting in that it's a port the other way around this time.

Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 07:33 PM.

@clebin

Some XBox fans thought these videos only showed CG artwork, IMO that sounds like enough of a compliment. I looked at all the screenshots and sorry I don't think they show the same level of realistic detail and lighting as I have seen in GT5/GTHD shots. I am not saying Forza 2 may not end up being a better game overall, but IMO give credit where credit is due, people may be thinking you are just watching television coverage while playing this game.

Last edited by MikeB on 21-Dec-2006 at 07:48 PM.

@MikeB

What I've seen people claim is that the mountains look like photographs/renders that are merely shown in the background to give the impression of depth.

I really haven't seen anything that shows they aren't. They look fine by themselves albeit they look like they aren't part of the engine. If they are it can surely be adjusted with lighting to fit in better. But hey, in a sense it could be kind of cool with several layers of mountain pictures and some good old-fashioned parallax scrolling

Quote:

people may be thinking you are just watching television coverage while playing this game.

Maybe while watching replays, but the same goes for Project Gotham Racing 3. While racing Gran Turismo doesn't look or act realistic and so far I've only seen PGR3 deliver on pretty realistic immersion (it wasn't perfect, but the best I've seen) by placing you in first person with full ####pit and fully modelled interior around you complete with reflections, light breaking through the windshield onto your racer's hands, lights from cars behind you and the world reflecting in the windshield.

Gran Turismo has had pretty replays since day 1, but that's not what you're playing. And considering the platform it's running on I'm not impressed by Gran Turismo HD - it looks like a scaled-up PS2 game in some areas.

Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 07:57 PM.

@Trezzer

Quote:

And considering the platform it's running on I'm not impressed by Gran Turismo HD - it looks like a scaled-up PS2 game in some areas

I agree. I think that's why they cancelled GTHD and are working on GT5 instead. I'm sure they learned some things and GT5 will be overall better visually.

@Trezzer

Luckily a port which improved on the original.

"Fight Night Round 3 feels like one of the few launch games that has been optimized for the PS3."

"There's no doubt that the PS3 version of Round 3 is the strongest of all of the releases when it comes to visuals....I hooked up the 360 version on one TV channel and ran the PS3 game on another, both CPU-controlled with the same match at the same arena. It was no contest."

http://ps3.gamespy.com/playstation-3/ea-sports-fight-night-round-3/751887p1.html

Makes me wonder, do you feel at least a bit glad for PS3 owners. Also if this happens with regard to future cross platform titles? Some online media seem to want to paint PS3 buyers as being "dumbasses".

I think we will slowly see a Rocky style PS3 comeback (the old champ, returning to full glory) during the European launch. First it's all boo boo boooo, and then maybe becomes PS3! PS3! PS3!

@MikeB

Oh really?

Actually, gamevideos.com has a side by side video of Fight Night Round 3 in 720p, and while I spotted one new effect (light bleeding) I also noticed that all the nice particle-like effects were just missing on the PS3. The boxers' skin also seemed less detailed, but since it could be down to the less contrasted output we usually see in these comparisons I didn't take too much note of it.

I wish I would be more impressed by the PS3, really. In all honesty. The only thing I've seen so far, that made me think "wow, that looks nice" is White Knight Story. I don't doubt the machine has potential. I just strongly question whether it is as great as Sony likes to paint it - especially considering how much more powerful the 360's GPU is.

Last edited by Trezzer on 21-Dec-2006 at 09:10 PM.

@Trezzer

More shots for those who want to check it out & their conclusion.
'The Xbox 360 had better graphics in almost all the games we examined. The 360's biggest victories were in Madden 07 and Fight Night Round 3, where the differences in texture detail and lighting stood out in our comparison shots. We couldn't capture this in the screenshots, but the Xbox 360 games generally offered better framerates too. '

http://www.gamespot.com/features/6162742/index.html

I think we talked about the RR6 vs RR7 in this thread. But the 360 has more details, more water effects, boats , and more textures.

*Now this is Gen1 for the PS3. It feels like those developers cut out a few things, likely they were encouraged by Sony to make the launch window. I'm expecting next Christmas they'll be closer and perhaps the PS3 will even be ahead in some cases.

... Getting back to HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray... In 1999 6.7% of homes had DVD players. Finally DVD players pulled ahead as there are 81% of homes w/ DVDs and 79% w/ VCRs, according to Nielson ratings... I don't see those 81% of homes running out to replace that DVD player with either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD very quickly -- Especially when you're talking $100 DVD player or $600+ for a next gen player.