@AndyC

Had another longer look at it and you're right, it was posted by an American friend on Facebook and I only watched it the once (my bad) but on my first view of it and the words used I thought " here we go again another religious nutter"...

Have watched it again and not silenced myself from laughing by the time he actually made his closing statement, you are of course right, a very clever play on words and use of old bigoted text to highlight the absurdity of some today and comparing them to the racists of the 50's...

Apologies to the pastor from me (he made that one just a wee bit too clever) and I'd better let everyone on Facebook whom thought the same as I did to actually listen carefully to the end of it...

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@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote: @jaokim Quote: Well. By the very same reasoning, couldn't black people have been talked out of marrying white people? I mean, yes, they are born black, but they don't need to act on these unwanted feelings, right? I think people's racial identity has more substance to it than just a predesignated attraction to black people of the opposite sex! Are you for real? They have genes that give them a black skin colour irrespective of who they marry! Acting on homosexual thoughts however is a choice, having black skin isn't. No comparison. In no way can finding someone of a different race to you attractive be seen as 'unwanted' unless the other person is already married or somehow closely related to you. Unless of course both those categories are both now fair game in the ever evolving 'Brave New World' of jaokim's sexuality social experiment? The liberals seem to be calling the shots so what constitutes incest these days in your head? Is adultery fine in your twisted universe as long as the two parties 'felt' they were in love?

I never said having black skin was a choice. Being black and marrying a white person is however a choice. And with your reasonng, this shouldn't be allowed either, since it redefines marriage? Where in your holy bible does God actially say that it is okay to have interracial marriage?

I've said it before, you can't use the bible and cherry pick the parts that coincide with your hatred and homophobia.

Just like in the 50's and 60's when you wanted to stop interracal marriage, couldn't you have stopped it by claiming that a black person wanting to marry a white person just acted on unwanted feelings? Couldn't they aswell be treated with some counselling in order to let only white people marry each other?

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@jaokim

The Bible has issue with Christians marrying non-Christians i.e. people who are not God's people. It doesn't disallow inter-racial marriages.

2 Corinthians 6:14

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Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?

As stated previously if there were more Christians such as Granville Sharp doing their part in public service these inter-racial issues would have been dealt with during the abolition of slavery!

#1157
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The point is Granville Sharp, a Christian in the UK made sure black people never became second class citizens post-slavery whereas no similar Christian figure made that stand in the US and the segregation problems stretched on into the 1960's. The message is clear. If Christians stand up for injustice where they see it, a lot of suffering is spared the society in which they live. By seeking to protect 'marriage' Christians seek to protect millions of children vulnerable to abuse and emotional damage in a heartless and increasing adult focused world. Marriage is the best institution to give children the best start in life and two blokes or two women depriving the children of a mother or father is INEQUALITY at work motivated by selfishness on the part of the homosexual couple themselves. Even Elton John can see it, why can't you? The Daily Mail: It will break my son Zachary's heart the day he realises he hasn't got a mother

Last edited by BigD on 22-Oct-2012 at 07:09 PM.

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@BigD

Quote:

The Bible has issue with Christians marrying non-Christians i.e. people who are not God's people. It doesn't disallow inter-racial marriages. 2 Corinthians 6:14

Are you married? Do you let your wife speak in church? 1 Corinthians 14:34 Or are you just cherry picking again?

@BigD

Quote:

Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?

The bible isn't very specific though. Its just about unbelievers. Muslims believe in stuff as well. Or does that quote in fact include muslims, only that you choose to put up your own interpretation by excluding anyone but the christians?

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@BigD

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The Bible has issue with Christians marrying non-Christians i.e. people who are not God's people. It doesn't disallow inter-racial marriages.

You claim that permitting homosexuals to marry is a threat to the sanctity of my marriage, but the only danger to my marriage is the attitudes of people like yourself. You will not stop your hate speech, until you have destroyed my marriage.

I said in an earlier post that any man who tried to break up my marriage was placing himself in harms way, regardless of which one of us he tried to seduce. You on the other hand do not try to seduce either of us, you merely state that we have no right to be married. Who the hell gives you the right to make such an announcement. My marriage is as valid as anybodys, and probably more valid than yours because I respect my wifes beliefs rather than browbeating her into meekly submitting her whole existence to serve my least whim. My wife is a human being, not an item of property, or a slave.

You have absolutely no concept of the real meaning of the ideals that most religions espouse and proclaim, and see your deity of choice as somebody who exists only to serve your whims and fancies, while claiming to follow his instructions. I suppose it is a just coincidence that your deitys instructions involve you telling the rest of the world to obey your petty minded campaign of hate against those who do not blindly submit to you, and nothing at all to do with your personal unwarranted ego trip.

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As stated previously if there were more Christians such as Granville Sharp ...

OK so that is William Wilberforce and Granville Sharp. And what religion were the people who opposed their campaign for equal rights. They were christians of course, as were the crusaders that waded ankle deep in the blood of women and children during the siege of jerusalem, and those of the Albigensian crusade who exterminated the Cathars, and all of the other example of "christian charity" that you choose to ignore. Most of the advances of civilised behaviour have come about despitereligion, not because of religion. The whole principle of parliamentary democracy is anathema to religions because religions exist on the principle that "everybody except me is wrong because my personal deity says so" The worst tyrannies in history come about when "political disagreement" becomes redefined as heresy

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When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout.

@Nimrod

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The worst tyrannies in history come about when "political disagreement" becomes redefined as heresy

Again you disregard the biggest tyrannies; Stalin's communist Russia and Hitler's fascist Third Reich both atheistic totalitarian dictatorships! Hitler was so anti-Christian he tried to wipe out God's chosen people the Jews!

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Thread

Back on track, I think this sums up why marriage is special and worth protecting. It's presented in a simple and easy to understand way.


YouTube: Let's Celebrate Marriage

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

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... and Hitler's fascist Third Reich both atheistic totalitarian dictatorships!

This is a lie worthy of Josef Goebbels himself. The Third Reich was led by a Catholic by the name of Adolf Hitler. It was supported by somebody called "The Pope" who people keep telling me is a Catholic. (Is the pope a catholic?) The policy of depriving Jews of basic human rights has been actively followed by the christians since the beginning of that benighted religion. Did you not follow my link to the massacre of Jews in the temple compound during the siege of Jerusalem by christian crusaders, or the massacre of Jews in York by the christian citizenry. The entire history of christianity is a genocidal bloodbath.

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Hitler was so anti-Christian he tried to wipe out God's chosen people the Jews!

When you try to exterminate the Jews, the term is anti-semitic. I just thought that you may want a bit of free education, but then again maybe you don't want to learn anything because it may contradict your prejudices. You may, or may not be aware that the current holder of the office of Pope, Josef Ratzinger, was once a member of an organisation called the Hitler Youth. It may come as something of a surprise to you to discover that this was not an anti-nazi society.

If you want a brutal military dictatorship, I suggest that you take a look at Oliver Cromwells actions in Ireland. His conquest led to the deaths of 500,000 Irish men women and children, as he acted as God’s executioner, exacting revenge and crushing all opposition, convinced throughout that he had divine support for his cause, and striving to build a better world for the chosen few. Or are you going to try to tell me he wasn't a christian?

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Back on track, I think this sums up why marriage is special and worth protecting

Except that you don't believe that marriage (or at least my marriage) is special and worth protecting, because you do not believe, for several so called reasons, that I have a right to be married to my wife.

Last edited by Nimrod on 23-Oct-2012 at 12:13 AM.
Last edited by Nimrod on 23-Oct-2012 at 12:08 AM.

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@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote: @Thread Back on track, I think this sums up why marriage is special and worth protecting. It's presented in a simple and easy to understand way. YouTube: Let's Celebrate Marriage

Gawd... I've seen and heard some patronising bullshit in my time but that one beats them all...

PS: Sounds a wee bit odd and even sick to me encouraging "BOYS" & "GIRLS" to get married, why not allow them to enjoy their childhood first wait until they are "MEN" & "WOMEN" before encouraging youngsters to get tied down in wedlock and create family's while they are still just kids themselves...

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@BigD

Quote:

Back on track, I think this sums up why marriage is special and worth protecting. It's presented in a simple and easy to understand way. YouTube: Let's Celebrate Marriage

It seems odd to me that we have a law that doesn't have the traits your video describes. The video claims the reason to be married is to have kids. However, the marriage laws are concerned about the relationship between two adults. There's nothing stating anything about a mandate to have or a mandate not to have kids within or outside a marrige.

@BigD.

I want to play off your no identified 'gay gene' idea. You claim there to be none and therefore claim that being gay is a choice. Well, another condition, autism, doesn't have any identified 'autistic gene'. Yet even without said gene it's the case that Autism brains structure is different than normal brains. Likewise it appears that gay brains structure is different than straight members of the same sex.

Now we have 2 conditions here. Both conditions appear to have no genetic cause. Both conditions appear to have physical distinguishing characteristics from the 'norm'. You claim that gayness is therefore a choice. Under your logic you'd also have to conclude that autism is a choice.

So my question - Do you make such as conclusion? And if not why not? What's the difference between the two that you use for seperation in conclusion?

@BrianK

Quote:

So my question - Do you make such as conclusion? And if not why not? What's the difference between the two that you use for seperation in conclusion?

People don't have the choice to act on their autism or not they just have autism and have to cope with the implications. People with feelings of homosexual attraction can either embrace them and act on them, or they can interpret them to be unhelpful, unwarranted and reject them. Over time and with support they may cease to have the feelings/thoughts altogether.

Hence, this is not a direct comparison.

Last edited by BigD on 23-Oct-2012 at 08:44 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Nimrod

Quote:

This is a lie worthy of Josef Goebbels himself. The Third Reich was led by a Catholic by the name of Adolf Hitler. It was supported by somebody called "The Pope" who people keep telling me is a Catholic.

You can't try and eradicate a whole race of people never mind those that will always be set apart as God's 'chosen people' and STILL be categorised to be a Christian! Hitler Youth Movement was set up so that young people would worship Hitler not God. That is encouraging idolatry amongst his own people. Why is that so hard for you to comprehend. News flash; not all Catholics are Christians



The Third Reich was an atheistic fascist tyranny that warns us of the danger of a lack of Christians and people of moral calibre making a stand against arrogant dangerous people who want to destroy everything that is good, pure and decent about our society.

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Quote:

You can't try and eradicate a whole race of people never mind those that will always be set apart as God's 'chosen people' and STILL be categorised to be a Christian!

This particular form of lie is referred to as the "No true Scotsman" fallacy. The genocide comitted against the jewish populations of Europe and others is not the only example of what a real christian is. It doesn't matter if you carry out the usual christian charity of walking by with your face averted, the fact remains that the rest of the world have come to fear and despise people like you. You have managed to cite a grand total of two people who have lived up to the PR image that you are trying to portray, which is pretty poor considering that you have almost two thousand years to pick and choose from. Judging by the history of the christian religion, Hitlers genocide is the main justification for classing him as a true christian.

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The Third Reich was an atheistic fascist tyranny that warns us of the danger of a lack of Christians

If my memory serves me correctly it was the atheistic Russian army that fought the nazis to a standstill in a place called Stalingrad, and then pushed them back to Berlin, and they did not achieve this by meekly saying their prayers. You may choose to try to disassociate yourself from the atrocities comitted by christians but the fact remains that throughout history Christians have routinely been among the worst offenders. And Adolf as a catholic is far from the worst, or only example of christian genocidal maniacs spreading hate in the name of love.
You smugly state that not every christian is a catholic, and by doing so you display your arrogance and ignorance with pride. If you can be bothered to check, you will find that I also cited somebody called Oliver Cromwell. News flash for the hard of thinking. Cromwell was a theocratic puritan genocidal maniac who massacred catholic men, women, and children to spread the news of his deitys "love".

The more that you preach your particular hate message, the more you sound like this particular excuse for a human

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@Nimrod

Quote:

And Adolf as a catholic is far from the worst, or only example of christian genocidal maniacs spreading hate in the name of love.

He might of been raised a Catholic, picked a saint at confirmation or whatever but there is no way he came to know Jesus as his personal Lord and Saviour and there is very little chance he ever repented of his war crimes committed in World War 2. This is not the sign of a Christian but a hardened atheist. I think you need to look at how you define a Christian!? Stalin was an atheist, Hitler was an atheist, Pol Pot was an atheist and Mao Zedong was an atheist. Between them they were responsible for the deaths of millions upon millions of non-combatants;

Mao 40 to 70 million people
Stalin 34 to 49 million
Pol Pot 2 million
Hitler 12 million civilians

UK governments are already responsible for 6.4 million murdered babies from state sanctioned abortion since 1968. David Cameron now wants to add the destruction of marriage to the UKs already long list of misdemeanors. And we EXPECT to have a good standard of living and a growing economy as a matter of course! Do you really think we deserve it with our track record?

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Quote:

Quote: So my question - Do you make such as conclusion? And if not why not? What's the difference between the two that you use for seperation in conclusion? People don't have the choice to act on their autism or not they just have autism and have to cope with the implications. People with feelings of homosexual attraction can either embrace them and act on them, or they can interpret them to be unhelpful, unwarranted and reject them. Over time and with support they may cease to have the feelings/thoughts altogether. Hence, this is not a direct comparison.

I'd beg to differ. Autism is a spectrum disorder. By this I mean there are people that have less Autistic Traits and more Autistic Traits. Psychology tells us from their research that sexuality is also a spectrum between straight - bi - gay. You've cited gay people who choose to not be sexually active. You posted that the same people said they feel their gay attraction but choose to not act on it. Additionally the evidence is there that 'pray the gay' that just doesn't work for most gays. Likewise we see people on the lower end of Autistic scale that can change their behaviours to be more the expectation. They're still Autistic but they have a degree of control. There are also severe Autistic cases which are less able and don't have that degree of control.

I think the comparision still stands fairly well. Non-genetic but shown physical constructs which lead to a condition which may be semi-controllable but no guarantee of controllability.

@BigD

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This is not the sign of a Christian but a hardened atheist. I think you need to look at how you define a Christian!? Stalin was an atheist, Hitler was an atheist, Pol Pot was an atheist and Mao Zedong was an atheist.

By the same definition, your'e also a hardened atheist.

You might as well be standing there hand in hand with Fred Phelps killing people like Matthew Shepard, whose only crime is falling in love. You are equally responsible for these hate killings.
If you truly believe in God and the word of Jesus, you would know better than to advocate murder.

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@BigD

Quote:

This is not the sign of a Christian but a hardened atheist

Hitler was born a catholic, raised as a catholic, attended classes and was confirmed as a catholic. His marriage in the final days of the war was solemnised by a catholic priest who later administered the last rites, to a catholic. At no point in his "career" did the pope see fit to excommunicate Hitler, and his activities mirror the activities of the collective christian groups over the centuries, so by any definition he was a christian and a catholic. You conveniently neglect to mention the germ warfare carried out against the North American Indians by the churches that depopulated swathes of that continent, or the actions of the conquistadores in South America. You keep overlooking the activities of Cromwell in Ireland, and the repeated atrocities carried out by crusaders, both in the holy land, and southern France. Also the persecution of Jews was not a new idea dreamed up in the 20th century as is evidenced by their expulsion from England shortly after the massacre of Jews in York.

Working on the principle that actions speak louder than words, Adolf was a very good christian as he followed the example set by all of the other good litttle christians. Currently also following the tradition of hate and intolerance are yourself and your mate Fred Phelps.

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UK governments are already responsible for 6.4 million murdered babies from state sanctioned abortion since 1968

And I suppose that you will accuse any man of killing forty million every time he uses a contraceptive sheath. The abortion laws were passed by a democratically elected govenment. Democracy means that you get an equal say, and you do not get to exercise a veto on progress because your non existent invisible friend says so. If you do not like abortion, then don't have an abortion. Your opinion does not give you a mandate to interfere and overrule the decisions made by others.

Your belief that you have mor rights than the rest of us makes you no different than the islamic fanatic with a mass of explosives strapped to his body.

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@Nimrod

Quote:

And I suppose that you will accuse any man of killing forty million every time he uses a contraceptive sheath. The abortion laws were passed by a democratically elected government. Democracy means that you get an equal say, and you do not get to exercise a veto on progress because your non existent invisible friend says so. If you do not like abortion, then don't have an abortion. Your opinion does not give you a mandate to interfere and overrule the decisions made by ot

Yeah real progress to turn UK Plc into a force of death and destruction with mass killings more than 3 times that of Pol Pot since 1968. Yes I can't really see how you view that as progress?! I guess unborn children are easier to murder because they have no voice. I guess you'll sleep soundly tonight because you believe democracy was carried out? The problem was the church bought the line that abortions would be used in cases where the mother's life was in danger only! What a lie that turned out to be!!!

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More than 6 million abortions later the figures reveal that in 99.5% of cases where an unborn child’s life is ended there is no risk to the health of the mother.

So just 143 abortions took place where a woman’s life was in danger out of 6.3 million!!! That is sick and twisted!

Last edited by BigD on 25-Oct-2012 at 01:12 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios