@Jorge

Body weight can come down this quickly, however you won't build up muscles this way, but less fat/water does make you see any muscles you may have better.

I guess it all depends on with how much enthusiasm you do this. I guess you can burn around 200 calories in 30 minutes if you play Wii tennis with much ethusiasm, which equals more than 1 kilo body fat in 6 weeks. However the water percentage is also an important factor, body weight can fluctuate a lot. You may want to burn fat, but not evaporate too much water (drink!).

But I guess playing a dancing game like this burns you even more calories:
http://www.bofunk.com/video/1949/dancing_game.html

Of course you can do such things on your PS2 at home as well:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FofhsBxBjV0

Last edited by MikeB on 20-Jan-2007 at 07:05 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 20-Jan-2007 at 07:04 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 20-Jan-2007 at 06:36 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 20-Jan-2007 at 06:33 PM.

@MikeB

I dread the day my metabolism is gonna change... I drink lots of water and eat insane amounts... Yet my weight fluctuates like mad. I'm currently 72kg but I can go from 72 to 64 to 72 to 65 within a year...

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@AMiGR

You lucky g*t

@minator

Quote:

The story is so wrong it's not worth reading but this is part due to the slide being rather misleading.

Hence why I only referred to the picture not the article. I wouldn’t deep link an image.

Quote:

It is misleading because the "local memory" is RSX actually graphics memory.

This is a matter of interpretation issue from the article's author, but I did state refer to the picture i.e. I was not referring to the article.

Quote:

It's also now wrong, the XDR memory read speed for the Cell has since been measured at > 20 GBytes per second

Link?

Anyway, that was not the point. The contention was with '40GB/s' during the RSX's MIA (missing in action) status.

Last edited by Hammer on 21-Jan-2007 at 12:23 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 20-Jan-2007 at 11:49 PM.

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Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @jtsiren Quote: I would still like to learn more about which is better: Xbox 360 or PS3. Which is better? The one that fulfills your needs the best. As far as power these 2 consoles are more equivalent then the PS2 and Xbox were. Neither company is going to fold up their gaming divisions. Both will be here tomorrow both have said they'll release future consoles. Which is better truly is on the user.

Obviously. I probably should have been more clear, sorry about that, I was referring to the most powerful machine for a "regular gamer use", if there is such a thing - like the comparison you made with PS2 and Xbox where we had a clear performance winner in the latter. I mentioned earlier in the thread that especially for non-gamers I can certainly understand why people value different things (e.g. which is why I still have a PS2 for Sing Star and why I like Wii very much).

I too have come to the conclusion that, at the moment, the two next-gen rivals are much alike in performance. It did surprise me that PS3 seems inferior in some cases, Sony & co. did have almost a year to polish it all while waiting for Blu-ray supplies so the first-gen excuse isn't that clear-cut IMHO. I am looking for (well, not actively looking, but discussing) reasons to upgrade from my Xbox 360 (or add next to it) but am currently seeing none. A reason might come in the form of a must-have exclusive game for the PS3, but in the context of this thread I'm mostly interested in whether or not that reason would come in the form of PS3 kicking Xbox 360's butt in performance on a regular, clearly distinct basis.

For this purpose, I think, most value of this thread has come from various links to developer opinion on these machines. Especially dual-format developers who know both. They have informed opinions instead of hype and want-to-believe. Personally I'm less interested in all the other hoopla, I know both consoles will continue to do reasonably well market-wise in any case.

Just my pennies.

@Hammer

Quote:

Quote: It's also now wrong, the XDR memory read speed for the Cell has since been measured at > 20 GBytes per second Link?

Try Here.
See slide 16.

Personally I prefer the 2nd to last slide - that's how well it does on a problem considered cell unfriendly...

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Whyzzat?

@minator

Hm, I have to take my original statement back. Actually 40GB/s was a bit optimistic,it's rather 25GB. And I messed up the write speed into vmem. While the rsx could read from main mem with that speed, the cell can't write the bitmap into the framebuffer with 25GB/s. Well, still 4GB/s left. Alpha would be slow, if you wouldn't buffer bitmaps in sysmem, because the cell read speed drops down to16MB/sec (that's real dog slow).
However, if you use a frame buffer in sys mem and "abuse" the rsx as a fast dma controller, that might work - but then you gotta buffer the whole screen in the limited 256MB main mem.

I don't know how they do it in linux (I suppose even the fbdev provides some basic acceleration) but its definitively not slow (but I haven't tried any hi-res yet - and won't in the near future).

Your document at the link talks about algorithm as such and how to optimize for multiple cores (especially the spe), but it does not address the physical bandwidth limits. These studies often use a X client workstation to visualize, which means, they don't really care how fast you can transport pixels - a still vital part in gaming machines.

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@jtsiren

Quote:

surprise me that PS3 seems inferior in some cases, Sony & co. did have almost a year to polish

Final PS3 dev kits weren't available until the second half of August 2006. Developers would have themselves become familiar with the dev kits, from October 2006: President of Enterbrain, Hirokazu Hamamura, says "We are unlikely to see games exhibiting a level only PS3 can achieve until the end of 2007." So if you followed all the news closely this shouldn't have come too much of a surprise.

Considering all the facts, it really should come as no surprise the quick XBox 360 launch ports mainly included improvements like 1080P, motion sensing support and sometimes some additional content, but also some minor shortcomings compared to the originals.

However developers have now become familiar with the dev kits. Resistance is a very good launch title, games like RR7, Full Auto 2, Final Night Round 3 are overall improvements compared to the originals. GripShift, Lemmings 2, Blast Factor Tekken 5: DR, are fun Playstation Network launch window releases. The rest of the games are about on par with the originals. The free Motorstorm, GT HD, F1 championship demos are fun to play.

@MikeB

Quote:

Poll : Sony PS3 vs Microsoft XBox 360 - christmas 2007 - Which will \\\\\\\"win\\\\\\\"?

It seems, that this is the most important question for AMIGA-users ...

The thread seems to become endless ....

alfa

Last edited by alfa on 21-Jan-2007 at 11:38 AM.

@alfa

The one thing I learned about this community and that I am in love WITH the community is for this. Bring a discussion and they will stretch it 100+ pages, it will reside dormant for five years and then bang it springs back to life for another 400+ pages.

No community I have seen in my fifteen years of experience does this except this community.

@MikeB

Btw. since you enjoy big boss battles so much, you should take a look at Lost Planet. I mean.. it's Capcom and if you know your history you know what that means when it comes to boss battles

See for instance the snow worm video for an example.

If you want to see an older (and not as impressive) build of the game you can grab the E3 demo from the marketplace.

@Trezzer

Yes, that looks very nice, certainly next-gen worthy.

BTW, I followed endless disucssions by Ridge Racer fans who own both RR6 and RR7 and I think Namco may have been treated unfairly by certain people, just with the aim to put down the PS3 or maybe 1080p support. Both games are overall similar, but within 1 year Namco did seem to have added significantly to the original overall, in time for the PS3's launch. IMO it would have been much fairer for these people to target their bullets at a game like Madden, which added little and was even slightly degraded overall...

"They added some music, some tracks, 1080p, drafting, car customization, and new online options.

I'd agree that it feels mostly the same, which is the curse of the series, but graphically I absolutely noticed a significant difference."

"I definitely think it is worth it. I played RR6 a TON, and I'm about 5 hours into RR7."

"I am really enjoying RR7. Been a huge fan of the series since forever. RR7 just has so much polish. It's like they fixed little issues from 6, made it prettier, added more tracks, changed the race structure around... definitely a fresh experience with the customization aspect and races that earn you different points for various manufacturers."

"Extra graphical touches, like waterfalls, fountains spraying up along the side of the track, FMV for the "jumbotron" instead of just still pictures. It does look different... better than RR6, but it is hard to explain without seeing it on an HDTV.

And the music... holy ****. Awesome tunes, soundtrack kicks all sorts of ass. The music tracks are LONG too, like you get done with a race and the music track hasn't looped yet."

"I agree. I own both and definitely glad I do. I find them both to be very different, except for some similar tracks and cars (but with extra tracks in RR7).

IMO, RR7 is more enjoyable because you are just racing the same type of races over and over again (like in RR6). Being able to upgrade your car is pretty cool and a nice change of pace."

"I own and played the #### out of RR6. IMO It's worth every penny if you're a RR fan.. and it's pretty fun online too."

"I have both.

RR6, got really into it when I started playing...then I just stopped (school, gf, etc got in the way)

Then I got RR7. Better graphics, better online imo, and theres some car customization and what not. I had a lot of fun with it actually."

"RR7 looks better and brighter (the new tracks mainly), is faster and the handling feels lighter. Also, the progress in the game is much more interesting than that in RR6. Oh, and the music is better."

"+ Extra tracks
+ Faster
+ Drafting
+ Cooler blur effect when boosting
+ Better textures and more color"

Last edited by MikeB on 21-Jan-2007 at 02:34 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 21-Jan-2007 at 02:30 PM.

@Jorge

I think it only matters of you want to play 3D games in something other than GameOS. Anything an alt-os is likely to get is likely to be old anyway so shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Anything is 2D is not going to be a problem at all as it can be written easily 20X faster than it can be displayed - unless it's in 1080p but then I don't know of many 1080p 2D games...

For any other use it's going to be fine.

Quote:

Well, still 4GB/s left. Alpha would be slow, if you wouldn't buffer bitmaps in sysmem, because the cell read speed drops down to16MB/sec (that's real dog slow).

That's reading from gfx RAM to Cell, very slow but such a rare operation nobody cares. If it is necessary you can use RSX to do a memcopy of sorts at GB speeds. This doesn't appear to be possible at the moment by alt-OS but should be perfectly possible in GameOS.
The 16MB read appears to be a hardware bug, it could have been fixed before production began.

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Whyzzat?

@minator

Quote:

I think it only matters of you want to play 3D games in something other than GameOS.

Actually that may be desirable - someone managed to get Windows 2K running on PS3...

I kid you not!


Hmm, if talking to yourself is the first sign of madness, what is talking to yourself on a message board?

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Whyzzat?

@minator

On QEmu? No surprise there, dead slow and works on all PPCs.

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@minator

A nice trick, but QEMU is slow when it's emulating the CPU. It's usually not even usable for a lightweight OS like Haiku, but Win 2K3 must be insane! I bet it takes about 20 minutes to boot!

Chris

@clebin

Perhaps the user may be better off trying to get UAE to run within LinuxPPC and then running PC-Task within it. Surely it's gotta be faster then QEMU

@minator

Quote:

Hmm, if talking to yourself is the first sign of madness, what is talking to yourself on a message board?

Actually, I am thinking of buying a second one. I have almost no chance to get my hands on it Its always occupied by my kids - and I'd like to play around with Linux much more, which means I'd like to set it up with a TFT Monitor instead. But I don't want to move it around all the time...and I have no good PC anyway (except my (work) notebook). So, either I invest into another PC, or, if the PS3 runs so nicely with Linux, I might rather buy one more of those...

I still have it hooked up to a 33" 480i, but the games still look amazing, even in that low resolution (still sit about 10feet away). And my boys can play their whole PS2 library - including games which didn't run on the PS2 any more, because the DVDs were way to scratched (that's the biggest surprise). The PS2 emu lacks some filter effects, but is less visible in newer games (e.g. Burnout Revenge). The motion controller in Resistance is , err, somehow, "stressing". Sometimes I find a Chimera grabbing my neck, leading myself to jump up from the Sofa and push him away ... which works great.

Remote Play on the PSP is funny - but usefull ? I don't know. Could watch the Lair Trailer without any flicker, which is remote streamed to the PSP. But cannot play any (PS3) games on it (was not supposed to work anyway). I haven't downloaded any PS1 games, yet, which are supposedly available to play on the PSP.

_________________
AmigaOne XE G3/933/VIA/FM801/R200 (fixed),
G3SE/600/Voodoo3/Sil680/RTL8139/SBLive! (noiseless!)
µA1-MK2/G3/933/R200/CMI8738
XE/G4 (broken 7450/800)

@Jorge

Quote:

The PS2 emu lacks some filter effects

Hmmm? There shouldn't be anything missing - the PS2 hardware is in there.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @AMiGR Quote: Ehm, game programmers that do not know about multiprocessing will have problems not only on the PS3 but on the XBox 360 and even modern PCs as well. So, please... try again. Have you noticed significant gains from many games when you went multi-core with your PC? So far I haven't. First party PS3 developers are like later Amiga developers, they have learned a lot about multi-processing and they are required to do so (it's a crucial part of the system, like the Amiga custum chips), else they will never tap into the true power of the PS3. I think when we see the fruits of their labour, many developers will follow and learn as they will not want to be left behind.

This reads like somehow you think it's only applicable to the PS3, which is fafr from reality. The 360 is multi-core, as are most new PCs nowadays. There was an article a year or so back from ID, IIRC, about 'moving to multi-core for gaming,' and generally, it was seen as not an immediate boost, which makes sense- code not optimized for more threads or SMP won't benefit much, aside from perhaps other apps running in the background, or communication apps (headset, chat, etc), unless something is really designed, and can take advantage of more threads.

On something like the PS3, although not exclusive to it, it's about determining what they can be used for to best effect, whether handling physics, enhancing effects, tracking certain data elements in the game, or whatever...but it does take some effort into determining just what that good 'balance' is- too many threads, or handling the wrong tasks in threads (or on an SPE), can serve to have the opposite effect, and actually slow down performance, as well.

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Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!