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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  AOS4 classic review
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nexus 
AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 12:15:54
#1 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

I played now for a while with AOS4 classic and thought it would be nice to give some comments on it.

My System: A4000, CyberstormPPC 604e/060 233/50 MHz, Voodoo4500, X-Surf, Terratec512i-soundcard and SpiderII-usb-card (unfortunately, both are not supported by AOS4).

AOS4 is really nice.
1) It's fast (but consumes far more memory than ASO3.9).
2) it's at least as stable as AOS3.9 (see below to read about the problems) and most important:
3) it feels like AmigaOS.
4) The "new look" is great and i like that you can set up the way the GUI should look like.
5) I like it that the grimmreaper can be ignored and thus, old software still can be used

EDIT:
6) You can move the windows out of the screen
7) You can drag the screen in any (!) direction! With AOS3.9 and a Voodoo4500, it was not possible at all to drag screen :)

What I really miss is
1) a (at least) fully VT100-compatible CON: and a more improved shell anyway. (I frequently use ssh and its a pain to login to a unix machine from the AOS4-shell)
2) OS4-Apps, so you can DO something with AOS4. Okay, there are a lot of things you can download form aos4depot but, it would have been nice if the most usefull things would have been preinstalled.
3) Big apps, not only tools and utilities for AOS4.
4) even more apps ;)

What does not work:
1) Most annoying: the screenblanker. As i wrote in some previous posting: first, graphics get distorted (lines are drown over other,means, no refreshment of the screen happens) and then it hangs after a while and it cannot be stopped anymore. So I have to reboot AmigaOS.
(blanker from ASO3.9 doesnt work as well. If it started once, it always starts as soon as I don't use the keyboard (means between pressing to letters of a word) or the mouse.)
2) The grafics distortion sometimes happens also on the workbench. So a window is not redrawn correctly, but this was never a problem. Simply by draggin another window over the distored parts refreshing everything and it looks nice again. (Yes, i installed the latest february-update)
3) the X-surf network driver crashes quiet often (during sufing with ibrowse) and then I have to reboot AOS4. AwebPPC I cannot use at all, then, the x-surf-driver crashes nearly at once. Dunno why. (Here, I assume it is the x-surf-driver. The browser window simply hangs and you cannot even move the mouse. So, I have to reboot).
4) GrimReaper works, but shows up to frequently for a lot of 68k-Software AND AOS4-Software

Edit: 5) Memory consumption is higher than memory is available. Some apps manage to consume so much memory that the workbench shows -1.423.133 RAM (e.g. quakeWOS)

Apps that are important and does not work correctly (downloaded and installed from os4depot):
1) SnoopDos (GrimReaper as soon as you click on "functions"), I think the same happens with "snoopy".
2) scout (Again a GrimReaper after clickin on some buttons)

The best thing that works and makes fun:
1) the warpos-emulation (thanks to GuruMeditaion!) (here, i first had to figure out, that the installer didn't copy the powerpc.library to libs: even though it pretends to do it (as far as I can remember). After copying the lib by hand it worked fine!)
In this way my old games perfectly work with AOS4, e.g.
a) PayPack now flies with warpos-emulation. Its A LOT faster then with AOS3.9 and you can play it in higher resolutions.
b) Descent Freepsace: Also, runs faster than with AOS3.9 and the best thing: It doesnt crash! With AOS3.9 it randomly crashed
c) Quake1. Wow. The warpOS-Version of glquake works nearly perfekt. I get a grimreaper of the "input.device" if I'm playing this game with my Amiga-Mouse. Its faster then the non-gl quake version and its A LOT faster then the aos4-gl-version. GlQuake from os4depot is extremly slow and doesnt work correctly. I have a lot of grafic errors here.

Edit: Quake-Addon: Malice does not work

d) Wipeout2097: flies like never before
(One thing, that doesn't work at all with this WarpOS-Games: The Joystick or CD32-Pad :( Especially for Wipeout2097 this is bad. I could not find anything to change in AmigaInput. With WBAsteroids CD32-Pad works).
etc.

2) 68-Emulation (GrimReapers can be ignored most of the time) :) Old apps still work with AOS4 with a reaonable speed which often is faster than a 68060er.

Still have to check a lot of apps, tools and programs. But I though, it doesn't hurt to write here a review.

greetings,
nexus.

Last edited by nexus on 21-Apr-2008 at 11:31 AM.
Last edited by nexus on 19-Apr-2008 at 02:25 PM.
Last edited by nexus on 18-Apr-2008 at 12:18 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 12:25:26
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 4705
From: Unknown

@nexus

Nice minireview.

What about X11 apps (AbiWord, Gnumeric, Gimp)? (probably, 604e is too slow)

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xeron 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:11:02
#3 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2003
Posts: 2434
From: Weston-Super-Mare, Somerset, England, UK, Europe, Earth, The Milky Way, The Universe

@nexus

Nice review. Just wanted to point out some differences between your own and my experiences (A4000/CSPPC/Mediator/Voodoo 3/RTL8029):

Quote:

1) Most annoying: the screenblanker. As i wrote in some previous posting: first, graphics get distorted (lines are drown over other,means, no refreshment of the screen happens)


Strange. All blankers work 100% perfectly on my A4000. Are you using Elbox or native drivers? I'm using native here.


Quote:

2) The grafics distortion sometimes happens also on the workbench. So a window is not redrawn correctly, but this was never a problem.


Very, very strange. I have zero graphics glitches on mine. Are you sure this isn't a hardware problem? Do you have a Voodoo 3 you can try and compare?

Quote:

3) the X-surf network driver crashes quiet often


That is a shame. I recommend picking up a cheap Realtek 8029 card, i got one on ebay for about 2, and it works 100%.


Quote:

4) GrimReaper works, but shows up to frequently for a lot of 68k-Software AND AOS4-Software


Really? I use a shedload of apps here and only get frequent grimreapers when i'm programming something and getting it wrong :). But then I have been using OS4 for a looong time and have long since replaced unstable software with stuff that works fine. What apps/utils/games are you especially wanting to run? Maybe there are alternatives I can suggest.

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ZeroG 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:24:28
#4 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 16-Jul-2004
Posts: 542
From: Germany

@nexus

Quote:

3) the X-surf network driver crashes quiet often (during sufing with ibrowse) and then I have to reboot AOS4. AwebPPC I cannot use at all, then, the x-surf-driver crashes nearly at once. Dunno why. (Here, I assume it is the x-surf-driver. The browser window simply hangs and you cannot even move the mouse. So, I have to reboot).


Have you tried this: Ariadne2 Patch

Some people have reported that it fixes the crashes.

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tonyw 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:25:30
#5 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2891
From: Sydney (of course)

@nexus

If you are suffering lots of crashes, then I would suspect your hardware first.

First check that your CPU is being cooled properly, fan clean and running, good airflow, etc. Then perhaps clean the edge connectors on memory SIMMs and check power supply outputs.

Others don't have these problems and the graphics corruption certainly suggests hardware failures.

You should not get a GR on ANY OS4 software. Older 68K software is less likely to be written cleanly, but OS4 stuff is system-legal.

As for a fully-featured console, there hasn't been one supplied with AmigaOS yet. The best you can do in the meantime is KingCon, ViNCED or any of the other third party add-ons.

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Hyperion Support Forum: http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:41:37
#6 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@xeron

Quote:

Quote:

1) Most annoying: the screenblanker. As i wrote in some previous posting: first, graphics get distorted (lines are drown over other,means, no refreshment of the screen happens)


Strange. All blankers work 100% perfectly on my A4000. Are you using Elbox or native drivers? I'm using native here.


I use the native drivers which come with AOS4. I don't have installed anything from Elbox to stay with a clean installation.

Quote:

Quote:

2) The grafics distortion sometimes happens also on the workbench. So a window is not redrawn correctly, but this was never a problem.


Very, very strange. I have zero graphics glitches on mine. Are you sure this isn't a hardware problem? Do you have a Voodoo 3 you can try and compare?


No, I only have a Voodoo4500 but these glitches on the workbench are really rare. But once in a while there are there :)

Quote:

Quote:

3) the X-surf network driver crashes quiet often


That is a shame. I recommend picking up a cheap Realtek 8029 card, i got one on ebay for about 2, and it works 100%.


Yes, but some os4-betatester wrote me, that someone is working on a native x-surf-driver. I hope, these crashes are gone then.

Quote:

Quote:

4) GrimReaper works, but shows up to frequently for a lot of 68k-Software AND AOS4-Software


Really? I use a shedload of apps here and only get frequent grimreapers when i'm programming something and getting it wrong :). But then I have been using OS4 for a looong time and have long since replaced unstable software with stuff that works fine. What apps/utils/games are you especially wanting to run? Maybe there are alternatives I can suggest.


hm. here i get those grimreapers quiet frequently (e.g. with scout and snoopdos).


nexus

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:42:41
#7 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@ZeroG

no, I got the xsurf-driver from a os4-betatester. I will try this one. perhaps this solves the problem :)

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 13:48:05
#8 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@tonyw

Quote:

tonyw wrote:
If you are suffering lots of crashes, then I would suspect your hardware first.


Hm. But i can run Freespace, Wipeout, Payback and some 68k-apps without any problems. So it can't be a hardware problem, right?

nexus

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Framiga 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 14:00:31
#9 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-Jul-2003
Posts: 2190
From: Unknown

@nexus

Quote:

nexus wrote:
@ZeroG

no, I got the xsurf-driver from a os4-betatester. I will try this one. perhaps this solves the problem :)


have you got a native XSurf driver from a betatester?

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nbache 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 18-Apr-2008 23:02:00
#10 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Apr-2003
Posts: 835
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@nexus

Quote:

nexus wrote:

[...]

hm. here i get those grimreapers quiet frequently (e.g. with scout and snoopdos).

Don't use Scout or SnoopDOS under OS4, they are obsolete at least in some aspects.

Use Ranger and Snoopy instead.

Best regards,

Niels

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redfox 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 1:40:58
#11 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Mar-2003
Posts: 1571
From: Canada

@nexus

Thanks for sharing. I hope the people here can help you solve these issues. Great bunch of guys. They've helped me in the past.

---
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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 9:36:47
#12 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@nbache

Quote:

Use Ranger and Snoopy instead.

Best regards,

Niels


Ranger! ah, I didn't know about that tool. I'll give it a try :) Snoopy, i tried, and yes, this works fine (although, i previously wrote, that there's a GR. Seems, that i confused it with SnoopDos).

@pavlor

Quote:

Nice minireview.

What about X11 apps (AbiWord, Gnumeric, Gimp)? (probably, 604e is too slow)


The X11-stuff, I have not yet tried but I will sooner or later. At least, I know from my Linux-APUS times, that gimp works quiet well on an A4000



@all

Does someone has an idea, why joystick/CD32-pad doesn't work with Warpos-Emulated programms?


Thanx,
nexus


P.S. The only screenblanker, that seems to work in my case is the module "pipe". All others causes this gfx distortion and then, everything hangs after awhile and I have to reboot.
Again, it can't be a hardware problem because WarpOS-3D-Games work amazingly well!

Last edited by nexus on 19-Apr-2008 at 09:40 AM.

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Framiga 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 13:46:33
#13 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-Jul-2003
Posts: 2190
From: Unknown

@nexus

Quote:
no, I got the xsurf-driver from a os4-betatester. I will try this one. perhaps this solves the problem :)



have you got a native XSurf driver from a betatester?

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 14:11:15
#14 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@Framiga

no, it is 68k. The betatester only told me that someone is working on a native driver.

And after patching the adriane driver, i know now, it's exactly the same I got from that betatester.

Here,that driver crashes nearly immedeatly with AWebPPC if you try to load e.g. amigaworld.net.

greetings,
nexus.

P.S. CD32-Pad works with PaybackWOS, but not with Wipeout2097. Strange, isn't it?

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Framiga 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 14:18:19
#15 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-Jul-2003
Posts: 2190
From: Unknown

@nexus

weird since i'm using it under AmigaOS4 and MOS for PowerUP without any problems

x-surf.device size: 17084

What X-Surf model/variant you have?

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 14:29:28
#16 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@Framiga

I have one of the very first X-Surf-Cards. That one with two network interfaces (RJ45 and that other old one, somthing with B ??).

I don't have problems with that card with AOS3.9 and Miami.


Greetings,
nexus.

P.S. Edited my review! AOS4 can consume even more memory than available. Workbench shows e.g. "-1.432.445 RAM"

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BillE 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 14:56:25
#17 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Nov-2003
Posts: 1117
From: Northern Scotland

@nexus

Quote:
3) Big apps, not only tools and utilities for AOS4.


If you are interested in astronomy there is Digital Universe

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Daedalus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 15:30:08
#18 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2003
Posts: 1292
From: Dublin, Ireland

@nexus

Quote:

nexus wrote:

I have one of the very first X-Surf-Cards. That one with two network interfaces (RJ45 and that other old one, somthing with B ??).


BNC connectors for 10 Base 2 networking

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Framiga 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 16:52:46
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-Jul-2003
Posts: 2190
From: Unknown

@nexus

"Here,that driver crashes nearly immedeatly with AWebPPC if you try to load e.g. amigaworld.net."

just downloaded and installed AwebPPC OS4 (first time for me under AOS4 ... not that bad).

First try (without any settings) i got a crash.

Copied my AmigaOS3.9 Aweb3 settings (SYS:Prefs/Env-Archive/Aweb3/...browser, gui, network etc.) and it worked as aspected.

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nexus 
Re: AOS4 classic review
Posted on 19-Apr-2008 18:45:40
#20 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Feb-2005
Posts: 415
From: Germany

@Framiga

hey! you`re right! Thank you :)
After copying aos3:prefs/env-archive/AWeb3 to env: Aweb works fine!

Uh ... but I`d had expected a nice error message if something with the settings is wrong!

Well, now, I wonder if the random crashes with IBrowse (which looks the same as with AWeb without env-settings) happens due to wrong settings?

But in any case, the ASO4-kernel should never crash due to a browser application, right? So this must be a problem of the x-surf-driver?


greetings,
nexus.

P.S. it is quite strange that AWeb works by copying the os3-aweb-settings to env:
In env: then are env:Aweb/AWeb3/OA4/ and env:AWeb3/
This means that the settings in the the OS4-drawer are not used, right?(at least after copying the AWeb3-directory to env:)

Last edited by nexus on 19-Apr-2008 at 06:57 PM.

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