Who are using some form of "Amiga" on a tablet?

(some form of "Amiga" == AROS/AEROS/Amithlon/AmiPUP/...)

Anyone yet?
ARM and/or x86?

Mouse emulation? (or some other way)
(another tracball link)
(fingermouse)

(I have access to a pile of tablet HW, so I might try one day)

Last edited by KimmoK on 04-Jun-2014 at 01:27 PM.
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@KimmoK

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: Who are using some form of "Amiga" on a tablet? ...

Hmmm - they are not really checkered, but at least those tablets are red-white...

Last edited by Dandy on 04-Jun-2014 at 02:25 PM.

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@KimmoK

http://forum.classicamiga.com/forum/showthread.php/5179-My-new-tablet-with-Arm-CPU-and-AROS
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=66980
http://forums.lenovo.com/t5/Android-Ecosystem-Developers/AROS-An-operation-system-inside-Android/td-p/1441741
http://www.android-hilfe.de/sonstige-apps-widgets/437171-aros-ein-betriebssystem-android.html

There is some kind of mouse emulation working with AROS hosted, but this doesn't turn AROS (and AROS software) into real touchscreen Apps.

Pascal 'Phoenixconsole' Pascera and Stephen 'ClusterUK' Jones where interested to bring Aros hosted to tabletts running Anroid-Linux or pure Linux. But i never heard they created a valuable product.

Aros on Android (How To):
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Aros/Platforms/Installing_on_Android

Last edited by Arko on 04-Jun-2014 at 03:14 PM.

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@KimmoK

Quote:

Who are using some form of "Amiga" on a tablet

Can't see the point when I can use my PowerBook with a real keyboard

For general discussion, here are some issues, as I see it:


Interface designed for much more exact clicking that a human finger can offer.
Rather easy one, design skin with huge buttons, increasing font size might make menus somewhat useful.

Only left mouse button.
Menus are opened with right button (which is a must), other uses are less critical. While bigger gesture system might be too complex, doing something like MorphOS already does with PowerBooks (2 fingers on touchpad for RMB) might be realistic.

Biggest issue:
Not much touchscreen-optimized software. Even something like calculator wouldn't work too well without modifications (making buttons bigger). There's MUCH more to (even) "passable" tablet experience than "mapping finger to mouse events & opening virtual keyboard window occassionally". Microsoft tried this "normal, windowed windows on a tablet" concept, and failed. Bad.

We could never be better ("as good" wouldn't be enough competition-wise) than Apple or Android when it comes to tablet user experience.

There is and always will be this small niche, who prefer "computers as computers" and can't understand why those "laptops without keyboard" are suddenly so popular. Traditional computers still have a market. That's what most Amiga users probably prefer. And most importantly, that's what AmigaOS was created for.

There's no way we could win there, but we will probably do way better than on tablets. Let's rather concentrate on what our OS does better.

@Jupp3

Since the "only one mouse button" is a problem (with a solution) on PowerBooks, I don't really see that as an obstacle anymore

Not being better than Apple or Android is not an excuse for not trying to be useful.

There's no way we can win ANYWHERE currently, so that's not an argument either.

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@thread

Thank for hints and comments.

@jupp3

Not thinking about winning.

From my experience of 8" fullHD tablet with win8...
it needs mouse or it should have trackball as a standard
(some tablet(s) have trackball).

If tablet had that trackball it would "suddenly" be a lot more
usefull with win8 and/or any desktoplike OS.

(today, if there would be tablet production for niche use with
Linux+AmigalikeOS etc. It should be sold with detachable
keyboard and integrated trackball. On the other hand 9/10 of
the mainstream features can be stripped off as we do not have
SW support for those.)

(this week I had to do some touch screen testing... and I wonder what other use is there for 5...10 pens on "paper" simultaneously in MS Paint .... well, beside testing the touch screen.)


And for unasked question "why":
- portable Amigalike niche HW availability is low
- Our niche OSs are 100x faster+simpler than android or win8 (in that way, more fun to me)
- some implementation often is better than no implementationat all
- if we had some tablets that we can install our niche OSs, it might ignite some
developments towards better mouse emulation at least (+multitouch gestures etc.)
- some people love to do grazy things
-etc...

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// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
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@KimmoK

Hmm. Bluetooth adapter, mechanics to hold it to the tablet, and a driver. Trackball on a tablet sounds doable

Trackball on a PIC: http://www.romanblack.com/trackball.htm

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@olegil

Quote:

Since the "only one mouse button" is a problem (with a solution) on PowerBooks, I don't really see that as an obstacle anymore

The powerbook (and all Mac laptops) do have two "buttons" and have since around 1999. You just need to enable "secondary click" in the preferences, then you put a finger on the trackpad while clicking it, viola - right click.

@KimmoK

Tablet computers...........YUCK! No thank you, I will stick to laptops with full keyboards (and at least for the next couple of years, a optical drive as well), or full desktop computers. But for those people who like tablets, I can see a reason for wanting better mouse emulation, or finding good USB or Bluetooth mouse or trackball solutions.

As for Windows 8, it is Microsoft's attempt at a touchscreen OS and I absolutely hate it on my latest laptop. I am so tempted to install some version of Win7 and get rid of this horrid Win8. Since I am NOT using it on a touchscreen device, I can't offer any opinion on how well it works as a touchscreen OS.

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@amigadave

every man has it's own interests, i have tried, but only for having succeed doing it in some way.. but it's all for having fun. not that it would replace anything.

i have bought the new amikit, it is supposed too support android, but i have no luck there, using LG G2 and LG G Pad, must do some more testing. and i haven't tested asus nexus 7 yet or my galaxy s3, but i have mouse adapter for all of them and have it connected flat Tv's.
i do get too look at the config setup when i start amikit on android, i see some settings for mouse, it looks like you could config the mouse buttons as you wish.
but, shall do more testing right now.

and there is this two amiga demoscene apps for android that i use.

Update: nexus 7 crashed, but Galaxy S3 did't, but told me there wasen't
no file to download, then quited.

i wonder how this work, anybody tried amikit on android?

Last edited by noXLar on 05-Jun-2014 at 06:03 PM.

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@Jupp3

Agreed. I've said it before, there's a reason Apple invented iOS rather than just shoving their desktop OS X on the iPad. You need to build a touch UI and the apps for touch from the ground up.

In short, Amiga OS would make a horrible tablet OS.

@olegil

Quote:

Since the "only one mouse button" is a problem (with a solution) on PowerBooks, I don't really see that as an obstacle anymore

Yes, that's the smallest issue, still worth mentioning in my opinion. And I guess people might be more forgiving on laptop than a tablet (and of course, if you don't like it, plug in an USB mouse. Not so often done with tablets though)

-EDIT-
With a laptop it's a smaller issue because you can see the pointer position, in other words, "where will you double click" (even if the pointer might move slightly when doing so). With a touchscreen this is going to be WAY more inexact, as you will define the click position at the same time you do the gesture, somewhere between your 2 fingers...

Quote:

Not being better than Apple or Android is not an excuse for not trying to be useful. There's no way we can win ANYWHERE currently, so that's not an argument either.

Yes, and we can still try to be better. And you can do that by adding a mouse and physical keyboard. Oh wait, we already have those

Last edited by Jupp3 on 05-Jun-2014 at 08:42 PM.

@KimmoK

Quote:

If tablet had that trackball it would "suddenly" be a lot more usefull with win8 and/or any desktoplike OS.

Something like Pandora or nvidia shield would indeed be more interesting. While not optimal either, moving the pointer with analog thumbpad works okay-ish. And yes, Pandora has also touchscreen.

Yes, any Amiga-like os would still not be an optimal choice for such a device, but there aren't that many on market currently either.

And before someone gets excited, yes, neither has PowerPC (if you were thinking of OS4 or MOS), and we can probably forget supporting any nvidia hardware from the beginning. I just mentioned those as "examples of certain (currently niche) device category."

I agree with AmigaDave. I have no interest in tablet computers. I don't even like notebook computers unless I'm traveling. Although, when there is a PowerPC notebook with OS4, I will buy one.

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@arko
yep. Tablet's were bad at that time. Low runtime, loud, hot and smelling like chinese kungfu Monks after a week of hard Training.

http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=video&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDkQtwIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DhXBtr59etdE&ei=gpCRU9v4GNTG7AbWkIC4BA&usg=AFQjCNEXfL899RzEYuGswJArN_F82ys2TA&sig2=x3T2a5sjtzcArzmCVlV8tQ&bvm=bv.68445247,d.bGE

There is a Project called AmigaNX to bring an updated UI to the Amiga and others.

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@logicalheart

I recently got old G4 powerbook (for EUR50 btw). Even when it lacks some support, it's great fun to use when I am not in my computer room!

Last edited by KimmoK on 06-Jun-2014 at 11:11 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@Jupp3

Quote:

Jupp3 wrote: @olegil With a laptop it's a smaller issue because you can see the pointer position, in other words, "where will you double click" (even if the pointer might move slightly when doing so). With a touchscreen this is going to be WAY more inexact, as you will define the click position at the same time you do the gesture, somewhere between your 2 fingers...

Like all touch based input systems, then? Sorry, still not an argument against it. Some GUIs will work fine, some will be fiddly. Like on Android, some GUIs work fine, others are fiddly.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@olegil

Quote:

Like all touch based input systems, then? Sorry, still not an argument against it.

Exactly.

Because of this, either 1)The underlying OS must not depend on accurate RMB clicks or drags or 2)It must be modified to not depend.

In addition, "it would be nice" if need for RMB clicks in general would be brought down to minimum.

And to be honest, with AmigaOS, I'd say we are already at option 2. Unpatched AmigaOS 3.x would have been a nightmare (if you needed menus), but with MagicMenu (where RMB is only needed to get the menu open, and it doesn't really matter where you click, you don't have to "hit" anything with RMB), all exact selections can be done with LMB instead. Although of course even that would need bigger menus.

And yes, I know that functionality is now built-in in all NG operating systems. I think it was possible with MUI to have visible per-window menus that can be used with LMB.

(Just wanted to point out that 1)Amigalikes need RMB relatively often and 2)The issue is different than on trackpad)

Quote:

Some GUIs will work fine, some will be fiddly. Like on Android, some GUIs work fine, others are fiddly.

Yes. There's definitely programs with good and bad UI's around. But there's one UI over all that shouldn't be fidly: The operating system UI itself.

But then, if we really aimed to be feasible tablet os, "rewriting desktop ui to be more (tablet) usable" (read: not "making it as good or better than competitors") wouldn't be quite at the top of "hardest things we need to do"...

Last edited by Jupp3 on 07-Jun-2014 at 11:16 AM.

@Jupp3

Quote:

Jupp3 wrote: @olegil Quote: Like all touch based input systems, then? Sorry, still not an argument against it. Exactly.

Forget it, it was explained to more than 10 times, there are still people that don't (want to?) understand why Desktop GUIs did not became popular on Tablets after they where introduced with Win3.11.

http://aliennerd.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/20111228-_1020183-1.jpg

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0