Quote:

fishy_fis wrote: @klx300r Haha,... I kinda feel for you. I've seen you trying to get an answer to this for a while now. :)

on almost every english Amiga site too to boot

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@Rob,

So nothing better than a AD to DA converter. I thought the AC97 Codec did a bit more than mixing. CD's sound much better than thru Paula when connected direct.

Recived my Prisma MusicCard (insulated) yesterday, and obviously dropped all my plans for that day, and barricaded myself in my Homeoffice (nerd den).
Read the little piece of paper that came with it, skimmed thru the Wikipage, just to make sure I didnt fry the card by doing something wrong, but the one picture regarding clockport installation is pretty much all you need to know.

So installed the card, installed the driver from the floppy, hooked up the cables (the Out in addition to the RCA passthru from the A1200 jacks/out).
Changed the AmigaAmp engine to prisma library, and it all worked instantly.

The Prisma card output very good soundquality without breaking a sweat while playing 320 kbps mp3s. Passthru works perfectly. Nice and crisp quality. I havent tested many programs yet, just AmigaAmp and Hippoplayer, but so far so good!.
Since Im using the A1200 for re-learning ASM coding these days, listening to tunes in the background while hammering away in AsmOne will be good fun

Whats missing on the Wiki, as Dan Woods/Kookytech pointed out in his youtube review of Prisma, is pictures of the pass thru from the Amiga, and a picture with labels of what each of the backplate connectors/plug ins does.

Overall impression: Very happy with the purchase! The MAS player was decent in its day, when 128 kbps mp3 files where common, but today, the MAS player is cripple hardware when lined up next to the Prisma MusicCard.
I see on Apollo Team channel some people are downgrading their movies to accomodate the current level of features of the Vampire to play the movie library they have. Same was needed to do if you wanted to use the MAS on a non Vampire Amiga. I simply refuse to waste my time converting movie and soundfiles just to play them, SO Im very thrilled that Amigakit sorted out the hardware bit music wise, just as Im confident Apollo Team with sort out the movie playback (to a reasonable level ofcourse, I realise there are limits).

I know FOL did mention he had tested Prisma on his A600+604n clockport, and it works. I do wonder if it works fine with a Vampire, altho I dont see any reason why it shoudnt.
I have read comment about the 604n frying Rapidroad USBs, but is this just hersay, or something that is an actual issue; either with the Rapidroad being overly sensitive or the 604n clockport being the issue....?
Im tempted getting a Prisma for my Vampire 600 too.

@Overflow

I do not know the concept of Prisma here, is the processor free to do something as long Prisma decodes or does the processor stop? On a slower configuration like 030 it still makes lots of sense because decoding is much faster by prisma compared to decoding by the main processor but in Vampire it makes less sense. Also Vampire is a closed universe, it is a shortcut to deliver something using the main system only for certain tasks more and more transferring on the card, at the end everything will work from card except keyboard and similar. In this concept is it possible to integrate Vampire in it. If Vampire/Apollo "only" would have been a pure accellerator then yes but it is not.

@OlafS25

Yes, I realise the issue regarding closed universe, altho when using MAS player, everything grinds to a halt when playing MP3s at higher kbps. Would be intresting to have someone that understand this fully to explain the different synergies.

Also, I am curious wether or not Prisma drivers can be developed futher to the point where it can be considered a soundcard instead of music.
Im obviously holding off any purchase until I see any definitive comments regarding the potential, and considering how swamped AeonKit and developers overall are with Enhancer and other projects, Im guessing they are hardpressed pushing the limits futher...or?

There has been some comments regarding the potential;

http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1120120&postcount=334

http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1124366&postcount=391

And regarding the hardware function of cpu, paula and prisma;

Comment from Daishi;

Paula is the coprocessor that handles the Amiga audio, it is a DMA driven 4 channel 8 bit audio chip (amongst other things it does) which basically means that it can access the chip memory without the CPU having hold it's hand and do all the work. This means that CPU usage for playing audio is very low even on the lowest end Amiga. Prisma however is a completely different beast. It uses nothing from Paula, to mix Paula and it's own audio requires a cable from the audio jacks on your Amiga to be plugged into the card and a circuit on the Prisma does the mixing, the Amiga does not know this is happening and cares not. Prisma uses little CPU as all it requires from the Amiga (not Paula) is access to memory (doesn't even have to be in chip memory) where the sound file is stored and then reads it. All the processing is done on the Prisma not the Amiga. Really the only thing that might slow down the Amiga is the memory bandwidth usage, which will depend upon the audio bitrate. Now to the Vampire So if even the lowest end Amiga can handle the Prisma, the Vampire with its CPU core 100+ times faster and faster memory (fast mem) bandwidth shouldn't even notice it.
I'm not even sure you could reliably measure the usage. This is not a game changer in regard processing or sound but music playback it certainly does the job (not CDDA yet which I think should have been included) Think of it like this, if a game was to play music and sound effects on Paula you are severely limited by both but with this, music could be thrown off to the Prisma and Paula handles multiple channels of SFX.

Last edited by Overflow on 29-Dec-2016 at 12:43 PM.

@Overflow

Prisma has its own soundchip? I always thought it is only a decoder that still needs paula for sound output. Regarding Vampire as I understand it they have promised 16bit audio and everything will work with the HDMI output. I am not sure if it is possible at all to integrate external components there because finally everything will run from the card. But I think asking in IRC or at least posting on apollo forum makes more sense there

when you write soundcard how is sound output done? Normally you need special chips for that that are not part of prisma. It is a high-efficient decoder making much sense depending of processor but not a real soundcard

Last edited by OlafS25 on 29-Dec-2016 at 12:58 PM.

@OlafS25

Well, each time Ive asked questions regarding Prisma on Apollo IRC, noone replies (maybe they dont have the hardware, or can be bothered researching it).

I realise its a MusicCard, but the comments from Toni made me wonder about its potential. Maybe I misunderstood his comments...? Most likely the case
Which is why I ask.

Again, noone that has depth of knowledge ever makes a definitive "Dude! Forget it. Its Impossible!" or "Dude, Forget it. Too much effort for the return!"

Last edited by Overflow on 29-Dec-2016 at 01:08 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 29-Dec-2016 at 01:08 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 29-Dec-2016 at 01:08 PM.

@Overflow

i have shortly looked at it, it seems it creates its own output signal so it not needs paula for it (as long sound format is supported). I do not know how it is integrated in system and thus if it possible slows it or not but Iassume not very much. Regarding vampire they want to offer a standalone device and all vampire equipped devices shall be on same level (SAGA, 24bit, 16bit audio and so on) so supporting 3rd party components certainly has no high priority except all customers would ask for it.

@OlafS25

In theory an AHI driver could be made that streams WAV direct to the Prisma.

FLAC test on Vampire 500 V2 with Prisma Megamix in A2000

https://vimeo.com/200954816

@Thread

Any news on the Rocky Road USB support?

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@BigD

Quote:

Any news on the Rocky Road USB support?

Strange request. Reminds of when one my friends very young brothers wedged a digestive in the floppy drive of his Spectrum +3.

@Rob

RapidRoad USB then Though the ability to use this funcionality beyond the mandatory additional purchase of an X-Surf-100 networking card is most definitely resembling of a chocolately mess and a 'Rocky Road' rather than a 'Rapid' one!

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Haha. :)

There seems to be some confusion regarding Prisma output but as I understand it has an analogue output just like the Amiga with both combined.

I made up my own mixer once when connecting CD drives to my A1200. Hooked some RCA sockets in the back of my drive tower. So the A1200 sound went to the tower. Inside I made a very simple mixer with some resistors that combined Amiga audio with the CDDA. IIRC it also plugged onto my mixer board. Then another set of RCA sockets connected to my stereo. Worked well for years. But yes these things should be available for purchase. Or included.

Anyway what I wonder is what the DSP on the Prisma can do? If it is indeed a DSP given it does decoding. We know it decodes MP3. If it can decode WAV/CDDA/PCM and send straight to audio output seems unclear. I'd like to know if can do DSP processing such as mixing channels together. Though it would need a multi channel sound stream for that.

Last edited by Hypex on 27-Jan-2017 at 12:22 AM.

Quote:

BigD wrote: @Thread Any news on the Rocky Road USB support?

oh boy please don't get me started again

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X1000 I BELIEVE

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote: I made up my own mixer once when connecting CD drives to my A1200. Hooked some RCA sockets in the back of my drive tower. So the A1200 sound went to the tower. Inside I made a very simple mixer with some resistors that combined Amiga audio with the CDDA. IIRC it also plugged onto my mixer board. Then another set of RCA sockets connected to my stereo. Worked well for years. But yes these things should be available for purchase. Or included.

Something like this? It looks similar to your passive solution, though it appears to be for towers / big boxes only.

Quote:

Anyway what I wonder is what the DSP on the Prisma can do? If it is indeed a DSP given it does decoding. We know it decodes MP3. If it can decode WAV/CDDA/PCM and send straight to audio output seems unclear. I'd like to know if can do DSP processing such as mixing channels together. Though it would need a multi channel sound stream for that.

Looking at the data sheet for the chip, it seems to be mostly a dedicated decoder rather than a general purpose DSP. It includes a hardware mixer like a sound card, but with only one external source. This could be Amiga audio or CD audio, but not both. I presume this is why the CDDA header is dependent on the planned add-on module that would also provide extra mixing hardware for the additional sources. Whether they're software-controllable or fixed remains to be seen.

Still, it should be fairly trivial to build a simple mixer that combines the CDDA and Amiga outputs before feeding them into the Prisma for final mixing. Not elegant, but it should work!

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@Daedalus

Quote:

Something like this? It looks similar to your passive solution, though it appears to be for towers / big boxes only.

Well yes something like that with two dual-RCA sockets. Except mine was a square formation like these:
https://www.surplustronics.co.nz/products/837-rca-socket-panel-4-way-square
http://www.fort777.co.za/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=2082

Quote:

Looking at the data sheet for the chip, it seems to be mostly a dedicated decoder rather than a general purpose DSP. It includes a hardware mixer like a sound card, but with only one external source.

Okay then. Well it looks like a couple of extra 16-bit channels. With extra functionality.

Ian Stedman sell a PCBs for a mixer board with some nice features and options for £4. It all though hole components so it should be easy enough to build by anyone competent with a soldering iron.

It has some nice options including the ability to cross fade the left and right paula channels, fixed level or adjustable mixing and it can either be powered from an external DC supply or the 12v supply from an ATX psu.

You could probably shoehorn it into an A1200 case if you put the audio connectors on on fly leads and splice the 12v from the floppy power connector.

All the details can be found here.

opps nvm

Last edited by Akiko on 27-Jan-2017 at 10:36 PM.

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