@Lou

Quote:

Lou wrote: @jiyong Quote: jiyong wrote: @Lou [quote]the 20GB model is no more...like I predicted in several a prior PS3 thread... Just hold your horses. They are very hard to get, but still available. For how long? I don't know. And have you remembered what else you predicted for the future?

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Let me spell it out for you: http://www.joystiq.com/2007/04/11/r-i-p-playstation-3-20gb-is-officially-no-more/ Yes, keep my predictions firmly implanted in the back of your mind. A blu-ray burner for a PC for $500, http://www.engadget.com/2006/01/26/samsung-sh-b022-blu-ray-burner-reviewer/ who saw that coming?

The 20GB version of the PS3 should never have been released. It's good that it's no more.

Last edited by KrasH on 12-Apr-2007 at 08:28 AM.

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Some serious allegations against Microsoft:

"Now some might argue that retailers won't want to take inventory they don't want this time of year. But Microsoft has a nice trump card to play here. They simply say, "Well, we have a big consumer product launch of Windows Vista and Office 2007 coming up on January 30. Those who don't take XBox 360s might have some trouble getting inventory of those products." And given that those products are pretty much guaranteed to sell in the millions of units for the year at price points of hundreds of dollars, most retailers will just take the XBoxes and call it a day."

Microsoft, Channel Stuffing and Desperation: Old Tricks for a New Era

Remember Gateway's and other companies' antitrust cases against Microsoft which sadly got bought-off by M$?

If true I think they should receive some serious penalties for abusing their PC monopoly!

Game sales forecast taken from BBC News:

@KrasH

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When will a $AUD 1,000 ($US800) PC be able to compete against the 360 or PS3? That's the $64,000 question.

Right now, just build it yourself. Go to www.tigerdirect.com and order all the components.

@KrasH

Quote:

The 20GB version of the PS3 should never have been released. It's good that it's no more.

Actually, I found it the better deal and Sony lost more money on it.
The "features" you get for the extra $100 weren't worth it. The main one was the hard drive but for less than $100 you could have put a 100GB 2.5" hard drive in there.

I I was to buy a 360 today, I would buy the core and a memory card and wait for a price drop on the 120GB hard drive... Then buy a cheap multi-format HD player in a year or 2...though the 360's HD-DVD player is a good bargain today. That should drop in price for the holidays...

@MikeB

Channel stuffing article seems to provide little evidence Channel Stuffing is going on and lots of allegations and explainations on how it could work. At this point it smells like FUD.

@KrasH
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When will a $AUD 1,000 ($US800) PC be able to compete against the 360 or PS3? That's the $64,000 question.

Build a $1000 AUD PC box with the cheapest Radeon X1900 (CTM capable) in it i.e. ~$165 USD.

Last edited by Hammer on 12-Apr-2007 at 01:45 PM.

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@KrasH

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How were they able to get it to look so damn good with those "limited resources". There is no way that a $AUD1,000 (cost of the PS3 here in Australia) PC can play Oblivion as well as the PS3 or 360.

Build a $1000 PC box with a bais towards the GpGPU (note that; nVIDIA G70 is not CTM/CUDA capable GpGPU/stream processor).

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@Lou

Quote:

The main one was the hard drive but for less than $100 you could have put a 100GB 2.5" hard drive in there.

Prices that low are at retailers such as NewEgg, this wasn't the case about a month ago they were hard to find and above $100. Retailers such as Best Buy and Circuit City you'll pay closer to list and over $100.

Sony should have used the 3.5" slot. It'd be a better value to get a 7200RPM 3.5" 250-320GB drive for that $100.

Still a useful way to backup that harddrive needs to be done. Memory cards via the Backup Option is good for small things. But, when we're talking the 10GB download sizes for 1080p movies using that method for backups is simply too expensive.

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Quote: The main one was the hard drive but for less than $100 you could have put a 100GB 2.5" hard drive in there. Prices that low are at retailers such as NewEgg, this wasn't the case about a month ago they were hard to find and above $100. Retailers such as Best Buy and Circuit City you'll pay closer to list and over $100. Sony should have used the 3.5" slot. It'd be a better value to get a 7200RPM 3.5" 250-320GB drive for that $100. Still a useful way to backup that harddrive needs to be done. Memory cards via the Backup Option is good for small things. But, when we're talking the 10GB download sizes for 1080p movies using that method for backups is simply too expensive.

Western Digital 120GB 2.5" SATA Hard Drive for $80
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3039496

@Lou

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Actually, I found it the better deal and Sony lost more money on it. The "features" you get for the extra $100 weren't worth it. The main one was the hard drive but for less than $100 you could have put a 100GB 2.5" hard drive in there.

Adding the wireless puts it above $100 (at least over here). That's also not counting the flash card reader - which is not a cheap one (it's fast).

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Whyzzat?

MikeB wrote:

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BTW, I am probably getting Oblivion for the PS3. The game may not have been designed around the PS3, but it looks like a quality port and it's great to have a game like this being released so early in the PS3 lifecycle. I was tempted to buy the XBox 360 version as I think the game is the XBox 360's best overall game, now I am glad I haven't! Oblivion PS3 review: http://www.gametrailers.com/player.php?type=mov&id=18458

More statements from EA, which may help to better understand why I so often stated that multi-platform games would probably be a poor indication to come to any console vs console conclusions. Note that their games, including the graphically improved and extended award winning (VES, visual experts) PS3 version of Final Night 3 only uses about 20% of the console's potential according to EA.

"In the same article, Gerhard Florin, executive vice president at EA, states that publishers have to build strong brands to steady revenues in the increasingly "volatile" market.

He also talks about the complexity of development on the high-spec consoles. "You only learn what you can do with these platforms over time", he says, estimating that the current run of PS3 games only use 30-40 percent of the console's power.

"We haven't even started to see PS3's power, it will take the longest to exploit in full," he adds, pointing out that porting across platform - something EA does a lot of - is harder in the current generation because of the vast difference between the consoles. "Gamecube, the Xbox and PS2 were much more alike," he explained

Last edited by MikeB on 12-Apr-2007 at 04:51 PM.

@minator

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Adding the wireless puts it above $100 (at least over here). That's also not counting the flash card reader - which is not a cheap one (it's fast).

Personally I think the 60GB version is a much better deal for the average PS3 owner. Unless people think Wi-FI and Flashcard reader adds zero value, but do think a bigger drive is important to you. The 60GB harddrive is not only bigger, it's also faster and allows way more cache, so unless you upgrade you may experience a significant performance drop with regard to installed games regarding loading times (such as PNS games), as well as with regard to games which use the harddrive's cache.

Last edited by MikeB on 12-Apr-2007 at 05:01 PM.

@MikeB

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More statements from EA, which may help to better understand why I so often stated that multi-platform games would probably be a poor indication to come to any console vs console conclusions. Note that their games, including the graphically improved and extended award winning (VES, visual experts) PS3 version of Final Night 3 only uses about 20% of the console's potential according to EA.

They also said that psx games used only about 10-20% of the power. This is as silly as saying that we only use 10% of our brain.
Why do you believe such marketing hype?

@MikeB

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The 60GB harddrive is not only bigger, it's also faster and allows way more cache, so unless you upgrade you may experience a significant performance drop with regard to installed games regarding loading times (such as PNS games), as well as with regard to games which use the harddrive's cache.

Really a significant drop in performance for the 20GB model?
What maker and model number is the 20GB drive?
What maker and model number is the 60GB drive?


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estimating that the current run of PS3 games only use 30-40 percent of the console's power.

I can't wait until they use 100% that'll rock!

Last edited by BrianK on 12-Apr-2007 at 05:12 PM.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @minator Quote: Adding the wireless puts it above $100 (at least over here). That's also not counting the flash card reader - which is not a cheap one (it's fast). Personally I think the 60GB version is a much better deal for the average PS3 owner. Unless people think Wi-FI and Flashcard reader adds zero value, but do think a bigger drive is important to you. The 60GB harddrive is not only bigger, it's also faster and allows way more cache, so unless you upgrade you may experience a significant performance drop with regard to installed games regarding loading times (such as PNS games), as well as with regard to games which use the harddrive's cache.

That would be me. Why slow yourself down to Wi-Fi when you have Gbit-LAN? Who needs a card reader when a camera and USB interface will suffice?

If I really wanted wireless, I could use a wifi bridge. Same for card->usb readers... In the meantime I would have put the $100 (+tax) savings to better use in the form of a bigger HDD.

@Lou

Anyway, you make some bold statements. Some might come true, others I have my doubts.

1-1-2008 or earlier is the end for 20 GB PS3 and only one model PS3 will be sold
1-1-2008 BR players (so not just a hypothetical add-on for 360) cost as much as an XBOX (I assume you mean the 360 Premium?)
1-1-2008 PS3 60 GB still costs $599

1-1-2009 PS3 still costs $450
1-1-2009 360 Core costs $150, HD-DVD add-on $80 and BR player $200

You still remember those?

@Tomas

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They also said that psx games used only about 10-20% of the power. This is as silly as saying that we only use 10% of our brain. Why do you believe such marketing hype?

1) They have no reason to downplay their own achievements, stating your games uses max 20% of the console's performance does not sell you more games.
2) That's roughly my point of view, like shared here at AmigaWorld way beyond the PS3 was even available.
3) Despite Genji 2 looks very good and performs well, the game doesn't even use the SPEs, which is the bulk of the PS3's performance.
4) Motorstorm and Resistance offer much more impressive performance than multi-patform games.
5) It takes additional investment to write new game engines. Making your game much better than the XBox 360 version will likely upset the XBox 360 userbase. Currently this userbase is roughly still 3 times the size of the PS3 userbase.

Last edited by MikeB on 12-Apr-2007 at 06:52 PM.

@Lou

Quote:

Why slow yourself down to Wi-Fi when you have Gbit-LAN? Who needs a card reader when a camera and USB interface will suffice?

Wi-Fi also allows peer-to-peer connectivity with Wi-Fi enabled devices such as cellphones, PDAs and of course the Sony PSP. Some devices support only Bluetooth others only Wi-FI, Wi-Fi is faster and covers larger distances. Bluetooth is often used in smaller devices such as cellphones and of course the Sixaxis controller.

The 60 GB PS3 supports both BlueTooth as well as Wi-Fi. Like you pointed out Gigabit Ethernet is better for very fast internet connections (if you have a fast internet provider and the servers you are connecting to are fast enough) or creating a high performance LAN (for instance connecting PS3s together for future games).

Last edited by MikeB on 12-Apr-2007 at 06:37 PM.

@jiyong

Quote:

jiyong wrote: @Lou Anyway, you make some bold statements. Some might come true, others I have my doubts. 1-1-2008 or earlier is the end for 20 GB PS3 and only one model PS3 will be sold

Already happened. Just awaiting a formal announcement from Japan as they supposedly still sell them there...

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1-1-2008 BR players (so not just a hypothetical add-on for 360) cost as much as an XBOX (I assume you mean the 360 Premium?)

Blu-Ray players are down to $600 ALREADY...and no, I don't mean PS3s...

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1-1-2008 PS3 60 GB still costs $599

Will the Xbox 360 Elite coming out at $480, and an 80GB PS3 coming out soon it will be interesting to see if Sony changes the price structure to something like $550 for 60GB and $600 for 80GB.

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1-1-2009 PS3 still costs $450

chances are high

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1-1-2009 360 Core costs $150, HD-DVD add-on $80 and BR player $200

I stand by this. And what will drive the Core down is a Wii price drop to $200 this holiday as well as a new Wii model that plays DVDs for $250... The following year, retailers will drastically drop the price on the core and MS will discontinue it in favor of the Premium and Elite models. There's a couple more "predictions" for you to keep track of since you have nothing better to do...

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You still remember those?

Yes.

Last edited by Lou on 12-Apr-2007 at 07:44 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 12-Apr-2007 at 07:40 PM.