@DruidPoet

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Our oceans are littered with lost cities and people whom have become legend. Sadly the human mind is short on recall and in a few centuries, people will begin to live on these areas of land on mass. Right now, the eastern seaboard of the US is an area of land that will get swamped

There's lots of interesting things that will befall landmasses and the related species.

There's a SuperVolcano that's under Yellowstone National Park. It errupts once about every 600,000 years. The last eruption was 640,000 years ago so it's due, geologically.

Nearest the earth is to an astroid strike is in 2037 w/ a 1/56,000 chance.

1/2 of California is predicted to fall into the ocean at some point taking LA, San Franciso, and San Diego.

There are earthquakes in the middle US - http://folkworm.ceri.memphis.edu/recenteqs/ we may lose Billsey?

Earthquakes in the USA and around the world.
http://quake.wr.usgs.gov/recent/index.html


Sri Lanka and the related area is indeed a great tragedy and loss of human life.


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Sadly, money, not technology is the limiting factor when preventing the massive loss of life we've just witnesed

Money is an issue. The correct communication channels and plans need to be in place and the public educated. Humans live for minutes, at most, compared to the span of the planet. When you have an event that occurs once an hour such that 3+ generations of humans never experience it, our limited scope of time seems to be a hinderance for early warning and quick action.

One news channel I watched last night said that the sea pulled away more then 1000 feet from the shoreline and villagers walked out on the seabed to see what was going on. They seemed very uneducated that the sea will be coming back quickly and they should be headed away from the oceans not into them.

Small update on the current figures:

Sri Lanka: 18,706 dead
Indonesia: 27,174 dead
India: 4,371 dead
Thailand: 1,516 dead
Maldives: 52 dead
Malaysia: 44 dead
Burma: 30 dead
Bangladesh: 2 dead
Somalia: 100 dead
Kenya: 1 dead
Seychelles: 3 dead
Tanzania: 10 dead

Indonesia has suffered terribly. The only good to come of this is the warring factions in Sri Lanka have called for a ceasefire. However, I suspect this will not last for too long

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@BrianK

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One news channel I watched last night said that the sea pulled away more then 1000 feet from the shoreline and villagers walked out on the seabed to see what was going on. They seemed very uneducated that the sea will be coming back quickly and they should be headed away from the oceans not into them.

This was a big problem in Sri Lanka. When told that there was a tsunami coming, they all went out to the beach because they didn't know what it was, and had never seen one before. Naturally, when the waves hit they were totally unprepared for the consequences of being there.

Last edited by _Steve_ on 29-Dec-2004 at 01:50 PM.

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@Thread

As promised, following is the offer I made on the aforementioned mailing list, the offer applies here as well:

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What are the mechanics of a Tsunami that would allow it to cross an entire large body of water, such as a major portion of the Indian Ocean, and devastate Sri Lanka to the point of twice the reported deaths as in Indonesia? I don't know anyone that I know is there right now, so this is an intellectual curiosity more than anything else, although I just can't stop mourning over this. So many lives! It is, however, an opportunity for the uneffected to shine, is it not? For most of us there's not a lot of opportunity to do anything directly, but I have composed some music that I would be willing to contribute if someone could get it performed and released on CD, all proceeds going to relief in the effected areas. I have a four part suite for Pipe Organ, called ?Sunday Suite?, a piece for solo violin (written Christmas Day) that has a sort of Jewish feel to it, I think, ?Candle Light at Advent?, and a Serenade for Strings, ?Serenade for Strings Number 2 in A, ?La Transformation??. I would be willing to have any of these pieces used on a benefit CD to raise relief for the victimized peoples. Is there anyone here who can make that happen?

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@

MSNBC has a Flash anim of it here:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/Components/Maps/Asia-South%20and%20Central/Map_Tsunami_Final2.swf

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@Quixote

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Quote: We would rather vote for tax breaks and other short term ideals than have our goverments prepare the world for the enivitable disasters we endure. Has there ever been a nation that has taxed itself into prosperity? And why are you wanting the governments to prepare the world instead of wanting the people to prepare the world?

The United Nations is short of the cash it is promised by all nations for the implicit purpose of saving lives after the fact. The western powers are the worst culprits.
The reason we don't pay is that donating millions of pounds to the UN takes away money that governments spend in other areas... like lowering taxes before elections.



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Further, there has been nothing similar to this in this region since the eighteen hundreds, over a century ago. What timetable would you have proposed for such preparations, and how would you have justified it, before the fact?

This very senario has been painted by geologists over the last 50 years. The evidence has been sufficent to persuade the US, Japan, etc to spend billions on detection systems that give notice hours in advance and if this event should occur in the pacific, a prepared and trained action plan will go into effect saving the lives of millions. There is no such early warning system in the Indian Ocean because the nations involved can not afford such a system.

The main reason why these nations cannot afford such a systems is that they are paying the west for debts inccured during the cold war and before, where the west poured millions of dollars worth of military hardware into the great melting pot, along with western sponsored dictators who stole, squandered and lost this great wealth.

When these nations were able to gain freedom from these tyrants, the debts still stood.. We are effectivly draining the third world dry to pay off debts that should never have been given in the first place.

To avoid changing the subject of this thread and because I'm on holiday, I'd advise you to wait til the campaign starts early next year. That way you can get more acurate facts and figures than my shakky memory can provide.

2005 can if we allow it, be the year that history remembers as the begining of the end of the third world and truely the begining of the developing world.

Peace, love and understanding to you all

@Quixote

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Quixote wrote: Further, there has been nothing similar to this in this region since the eighteen hundreds, over a century ago. What timetable would you have proposed for such preparations, and how would you have justified it, before the fact? ?

My girlfriends parents are engineers specialising in 3rd world development. Her father runs a steal factory but also designs and builds rapid deployment bridges, and works with many aid agencies. They live out in Papau New Guinea and got hit by a tidal wave back in 98. Other side admitedly - but same region.

@Quixote

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Quixote wrote: @DruidPoet: Quote: [quote]Support the campaign to abolish world debt that will begin next year. "World debt?" To whom is the world in debt, sir? Various nations are in debt to each other, but not the globe as a whole. How do you propose to "abolish" debt, except to declare that existing debts need not be repaid? And if you succeed at that, who would be willing to lend money in the future?

We live in a world in which we lend money to impoverished nations so that they can buy arms from us - so that they can either kill each other or attack us. I call that shooting ourselves in the foot. Better systems need to be implemented. Our loans to these nations have been driven by greed, not by aid. These loand were wrong - we saddled them with debt so they could arm themselves or line the pockets of their dicatators.

You could loan them money which they could invest and get a better return on, or use to build in the infrastructures required to make them self sufficent.

Take for example the East Tiamorians - They have struck gold in the form of oil. When the ausralians found out they did there best to steal it. With that oil East Timor will no longer require aid or to loan. Assist them in building up the infrastructure required (they can pay for it with the oil) and they can go about making their lives better.

Last edited by Bobsonsirjonny on 29-Dec-2004 at 05:34 PM.

The current loss of life stands at (confirmed) 77,000 souls. As always, this figure is set to rise, possibly even double once disease casued by lack of fresh water and sewerage set in.

Currently the confirmed deaths are as follows for the following countries:

Indonesia: 45,268
Sri Lanka: 22,493
India: 6,974
Thailand: 1,829
Somalia: 100
Burma: 90
Malaysia: 65
Maldives: 55
Tanzania: 10
Seychelles: 3
Bangladesh: 2
Kenya: 1

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@_Steve_

Worse and worse.

I'm going to take Toaks advice and send the money I would have spent on fireworks to the Red Cross instead.

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@DruidPoet

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Sadly, money, not technology is the limiting factor when preventing the massive loss of life we've just witnesed. We would rather vote for tax breaks and other short term ideals than have our goverments prepare the world for the enivitable disasters we endure.

I have to agree. This is a terrible trajedy but there is hope for the future. On 12/2 NASA News reported on a study linking wind and current changes to Indian ocean warming. NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory is working on studies like this to prepare us. It is to bad they were not able to give advance warning to prevent this kind of thing. However, it is up to us to change our way of living (we are killing our planet) I believe we have to correct damage we have already done to our planet's ozone, etc. or this will indeed happen again.

some links regarding study

http://www.agu.org/pubs/current/gl.shtml/

http://sealevel.jpl.nasa.gov/index.html


Truly sad

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AmigaRocks!!

@Peg

Apparently, India does have a warning system of some sort involving satellites, but their satellites failed to detect the Tsunamis at all. In an academic light, I found it interesting that the tsunamis wrapped around Sri Lanka and hit India even right behind where Sri Lanka would have, I would have thought, shielded India's coast line.

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@Billsey


It is quite common for a Tsunami to hit an Island and wrap around
as it passes, then the two apposing waves collide behind the Island
creating an even higher swell.
This often focus's damage on the far side of the Island.


Wol.

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@Billsey

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Billsey wrote: @Peg Apparently, India does have a warning system of some sort involving satellites, but their satellites failed to detect the Tsunamis at all. In an academic light, I found it interesting that the tsunamis wrapped around Sri Lanka and hit India even right behind where Sri Lanka would have, I would have thought, shielded India's coast line.

Bad Billsey!

You were skipping that day in High School Physics on the nature and properties of Waves didn't you?

@tomazkid

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tomazkid wrote: @_Steve_ Worse and worse. I'm going to take Toaks advice and send the money I would have spent on fireworks to the Red Cross instead.

My little sister just donated all her Christmas money Her generosity was not driven by media hysteria, or sensationalist pictures, but her belief that its the right thing to do. I'm proud of her for seeing the bigger picture

(and will make it up to her by getting her one of the albums she was going to buy)

@Billsey

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Apparently, India does have a warning system of some sort involving satellites, but their satellites failed to detect the Tsunamis at all.

Or maybe they did detect but there was simply nothing that could be done to save these people so they remained silent. Just a thought regarding human nature.

Also, I know you are aware of the big campaign WWJD(What Would Jesus Do), the spin off to that WWBMD (What Would Batman Do) Here is a new for you...
WWEL(Will We Ever Learn) Stupid Humans!

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AmigaRocks!!

@_Steve_

Are there any reports on how bad Diego Garcia was hit?

EDIT: Found out the island was undamaged

Last edited by DruidPoet on 30-Dec-2004 at 08:57 AM.

Peg posted:
Quote:

@Billsey Quote: Apparently, India does have a warning system of some sort involving satellites, but their satellites failed to detect the Tsunamis at all. Or maybe they did detect but there was simply nothing that could be done to save these people so they remained silent. Just a thought regarding human nature.

As I understand it, the wave was traveling about 500 miles per hour, but it started about 1,000 miles away. That left about two hours (theoretical) warning time. It is amazing how much people can do in two hours when sufficiently motivated. Two hours to move everybody a mile or two inland? It doesn't seem impractical at all.

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Just heard this morning at the Radio that today there will be some major assestment quake and another tsunami is expected.
This time people has been warned and seems that everybody is fleeing inland.
Jost hope no more deaths this time.

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Check my Amiga gameplays (ITA)!

What happened is really sad (and more when added to the recent hurricans in and around the Cayman Island, though not so many lives were lost).

@Bobsonsirjonny

>My little sister just donated all her Christmas money<

That is great ! Can I ask how old she is ?

Personally I think twice before giving money to "humanitarian Associations"... For the past 10 years (certainly more) in Europe (but likely outside Europe as well), those organisations have been involved in various scandals (I remember especially a Cancer Research Association) using most of the money received for their own purposes (Expansive cars with "chauffeur" for example)... And then we you go to them with a "humanitarian project" they just don't want to listen...

Now if there could be guarantees than at least 99% of the money sent, go directly to the people in need...

Now what I did a few times is to send food/clothes to the Red Cross and some other organisations.

Jerry

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