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/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:20:09
#521 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:
Things will happen! Not over night, but...they will come... Not a hardcore miracle but, x86 based AOS with a certain supported hardware will do good to Amiga and release it from the curse of the, "hobby" platform.


Did God reveal this to you in a vision? Are you His prophet?

_________________
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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:20:58
#522 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 955
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

Sorry, we in Europe are a bit far more developed....

Quote:
You obviously don't understand economies of scale, ROI, or the fact that the creators of HD electronics are in an entirely different league when it comes to funding, cash on hand, available credit, manpower, etc.


That is why I have you to explain me everything in life from worlds economy, current
and upcoming hd standards, preparation of pancakes, Amiga OS... From now on, you
are my life guru ...

All the best,

D.

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eniacfoa 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:22:02
#523 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 4-Sep-2007
Posts: 355
From: Melbourne

@fairlanefastback

as an australian, its a bit hard to protest in washington state ;)

Ive paid for classic amiga's and amiga forever. does that make me an amiga customer?

Last edited by eniacfoa on 25-Mar-2009 at 06:24 PM.

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:22:36
#524 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 955
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

Quote:
Did God reveal this to you in a vision? Are you His prophet?



Bill`s prophet ;) I have a dream! ;)

All the best,

D.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:24:12
#525 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:

eXec wrote:
@fairlanefastback

That is why I have you to explain me everything in life from worlds economy, current
and upcoming hd standards, preparation of pancakes, Amiga OS... From now on, you
are my life guru ...


Well then tell us how this will happen, since you are so sure. How do your outbursts of its destined eventuality help us?

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:27:48
#526 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 955
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

Quote:
That is why I have you to explain me everything in life from worlds economy, current and upcoming hd standards, preparation of pancakes, Amiga OS... From now on, you are my life guru ...



I`ll tell you the answer on that with an integration of two most known
Amiga slogans! Good, outside has gone inside Remember them!

- Time will show the difference! Intel Inside!


All the best,

D.



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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:29:48
#527 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eniacfoa

Quote:

eniacfoa wrote:
@fairlanefastback

as an australian, its a bit hard to protest in washington state ;)

Ive paid for classic amiga's and amiga forever. does that make me an amiga customer?


Hire Moderator Moxee to be your local organizer of the protests! (hey one way or another this x86 version is going to cost you!)


It certainly means you'd be a potential customer at first glance. But since your criterion is x86 it takes you out of the running to be one since Hyperion can't afford it and Amiga, Inc. does nothing for Amiga desktop. And the free AROS x86 you reject. I'm sure Hyperion wishes that you could be a customer. But you won't budge off x86 and they can't afford to go there. And Amiga, Inc. is off doing whatever it is they do (which is not Amiga desktop products). And I doubt you want AA2 right?

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 25-Mar-2009 at 06:33 PM.

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eniacfoa 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 18:39:19
#528 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 4-Sep-2007
Posts: 355
From: Melbourne

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote:
@eniacfoa

Quote:

eniacfoa wrote:
@fairlanefastback

as an australian, its a bit hard to protest in washington state ;)

Ive paid for classic amiga's and amiga forever. does that make me an amiga customer?


Hire Moderator Moxee to be your local organizer of the protests!


It certainly means you'd be a potential customer at first glance. But since your criterion is x86 it takes you out of the running to be one since Hyperion can't afford it and Amiga, Inc. does nothing for Amiga desktop. And the free AROS x86 you reject. I'm sure Hyperion wishes that you could be a customer. But you won't budge off x86 and they can't afford to go there. And Amiga, Inc. is off doing whatever it is they do (which is not Amiga desktop products). And I doubt you want AA2 right?


I never said I reject AROS. I said from what ive seen AROS is not viewed by most as a true amiga OS.

I have stated in a post months back, if everyone (developers/customers/donators) dropped OS4/MorphOS and got behind AROS we'd all get what we want - a modern next gen amiga computer. It was around then I noticed that people cared about OS4 and AROS could go to hell...

also, my criteria is mainly cost/power based. not necessarily x86.
it just seems that x86 is the only possiblity to make that happen.

Last edited by eniacfoa on 25-Mar-2009 at 06:48 PM.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 19:12:00
#529 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:
- Time will show the difference! Intel Inside!


So basically you are just a cheerleader.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 19:12:41
#530 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@bernd_afa

>>yes thast right, but developing software (not only Porting is a long term process)


Yes because porting an OS (AOS) to x86 takes a couple of days...

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 19:23:31
#531 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eniacfoa

Quote:

eniacfoa wrote:
@fairlanefastback


I have stated in a post months back, if everyone (developers/customers/donators) dropped OS4/MorphOS and got behind AROS we'd all get what we want - a modern next gen amiga computer.


You are correct and I agree 100 percent.

Quote:
It was around then I noticed that people cared about OS4 and AROS could go to hell...


Regardless, AROS has more of a feasible future on x86 than AOS given circumstances as they stand today. Thats why I've monetarily supported all three, AROS through bounties, MOS through buying 2.0, AOS through bounties and buying 4.1. So unless they all decide to combine under one banner and given there is no money to make x86 easily on either closed source OS, AROS seems to be our only x86 hope. Even if its slower than folks would like.

Quote:
also, my criteria is mainly cost/power based. not necessarily x86. it just seems that x86 is the only possiblity to make that happen.


I still see AROS as your OS then. You by the cheap PC hardware it supports and you through what you can at bounties you like or want to make. Progress will be slow, but it will be quicker than from others not willing and/or able to do it at all.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 19:30:39
#532 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

This is just messing around with useless, perennial x86 threads that have come up for the last 10 years.

Get a SAM and OS4.1, use it, enjoy it, suffer its glitches, develop for it.

We have been crying that there was no hardware and no OS for years, now there is hardware and a new version of the OS (ported to PPC) and we are not happy because we can't run it on cheap and fast hardware, which by the way is not that good anyway...

Amiga x86, unless Hyperion have been working in secret, is not going to happen, never!

Even if it happened who would actually give a flying monkey about it when there is Windows and Linux, two Operating Systems that have been running on x86 for years?

Amiga or AROS have got nothing to offer, why would anyone outside this group of old fanatics bother?

I think we should port AOS to the IBM Power System





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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 19:36:57
#533 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@TheDaddy

Quote:
I think we should port AOS to the IBM Power System


I'd love to see a PPC Mac Mini port. That would help bring more users and give new life to those machines, and they are plentiful and nice and small so not too bad a footprint for a second box if you have something else.

A more powerful system like you mention would be nice too.

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Leo 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 20:19:48
#534 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1585
From: Unknown

Quote:

Even if it happened who would actually give a flying monkey about it when there is Windows and Linux, two Operating Systems that have been running on x86 for years?

Who is giving a "flying monkey" about it on PPC ?

Who was giving a flying monkey two years ago when the Mac & Linux were both already running on PPC ?

The problem is the same, and will be the same on any platform... you have to give people reasons to use your OS. And be it on x86, or right now on PPC, only a little thousand saw reasons... So this wouldn't change.

And I believe even on the contrary... if this OS is so good, and so many advantages over Windows (or.. how do you guys say ? "winblows" ?), people will use it, no matter if Windows is available as well, right ?

If not it means there's really no advantage... In that case you may port it to whatever platform you want, people wouldn't use it.

Last edited by Leo on 25-Mar-2009 at 08:49 PM.
Last edited by Leo on 25-Mar-2009 at 08:23 PM.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 21:19:46
#535 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@Leo

>>The problem is the same, and will be the same on any platform... you have to give people reasons to use your OS

Exctly what I was saying before, go develop for OS4.1 and SAM now...don't wait for an x86 port.

Last edited by TheDaddy on 25-Mar-2009 at 09:24 PM.

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Leo 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 21:50:28
#536 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1585
From: Unknown

Quote:

Exctly what I was saying before, go develop for OS4.1 and SAM now...don't wait for an x86 port.

I'm not interested in developing for an OS written 25 years ago.

Building a new moderm platform without any stupid legacy would be very interesting and a real challenge though...

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 21:54:14
#537 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 955
From: Burkina Faso

@TheDaddy

Quote:
Even if it happened who would actually give a flying monkey about it when there is Windows and Linux, two Operating Systems that have been running on x86 for years?



If Hyperion , even AInc shoots out an upcoming x86 ported AOS, you will be among
first people who will buy the hardware and the OS itself. Won`t you?

All the best,

D.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 22:03:51
#538 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:

eXec wrote:
@TheDaddy

If Hyperion , even AInc shoots out an upcoming x86 ported AOS, you will be among
first people who will buy the hardware and the OS itself. Won`t you?


You missed his point. He said why would anyone outside our small fanatical community care. Not that he dosen't.

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ChrisH 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 22:48:12
#539 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6673
From: Unknown

Can those whinging for OS4 on x86 please just switch to AROS & shut up? As much as I'd like to see OS4 on x86, it 'aint gonna happen, even if I stamp my feet really hard, so we have to accept that & make do with what we have. It's call growing up. AROS no good for you? Well tough, but it seems like OS4 is no better for you either.

Can those who want to do the latest Windows/Mac/Linux craze on OS4, like say playing High Def videos, please just get a Windows/Mac/Linux PC & shut up? There is simply no chance for OS4 to (a) get all the applications ported to do all these things, (b) get them ported well enough that they are not slow (it's called optimisation), and (c) does not have the processing power & has never had the processing power to compete with x86.

Can those who want a faster CPU than the Sam440 has, please learn some patience? ACube (and possibly others) are likely working on 1GHz or faster systems, but this takes time & money. Sam440 was a first (or second) step for OS4, but it was not the last.

Can those who think that they know better than Hyperion what they should do, please just buy-out Hyperion? Then you can get them to do what you want. Don't have the money? Gee, that couldn't possibly be the reason Hyperion doesn't do some of the things you think are "obvious" for OS4 to survive? Perhaps you could get a loan from the bank? What, banks won't give loans? Something about a world-wide recession?

Can those who think OS4 can be ported to x86 in 6 weeks (or whatever), please tell Hyperion where they can find a free 68k or PPC JIT emulator for x86 that will easily integrate into OS4's Exec kernel & memory system? If you found one, you are likely wrong. Without such emulation, OS4 on x86 would be an expensive toy, because it'd have no apps or games to speak of. And if you think "UAE is good enough", then you might want to ask why people haven't switch to AROS then. Not to mention that if you're going to use UAE, you might as well use UAE on Windows, and save yourself the trouble.

Can all non-programmers please stop thinking they they know how easy it is to port OS4 to x86? If you've never flown an air plane, you wouldn't tell a pilot how to fly! So why would you suddenly think you're an expert programmer, never mind an expert OS designer?


Sorry if this sounds incredibly in-tolerant, but having come back to AW.net after a break, I am stunned at all the complete stupid arguments going on here. Really, it's enough to make me think of moving to Amigans.net, if it goes on for much longer.

Last edited by ChrisH on 25-Mar-2009 at 10:50 PM.

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 25-Mar-2009 22:53:20
#540 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 955
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

thank you, my guiding guru!

All the best,

D

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