Nice to see Fleecy is still answering questions considering the crap people have been aiming at him.

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I dont suffer from Insanity - I enjoy it

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It's really good to hear that the audio issue is going to be properly addressed at last. The single biggest problem for computer musicians is that of latency. A system like that which Fleecy is suggesting could really help to wipe that problem out. Add to that, the lower cooling requirements of PPC and, hopefully, drivers for quality soundcards and the platform could begin to look quite appealing for pro audio work.

That said, we're going to need some pretty hot software to take advantage of this - Bars&Pipes PPC would be a start......

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Folding@Home Team AmigaWorld no: 33424

The 64 bit AmigaOS implementation has always been a target, since we will be able to implement orthogonal persistence much more easily than on a 32 bit platform

orthogonal persistence ?? What's that ?

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Everything you say will be misquoted and used against you..
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Good Fleecy

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ikir

If I'm not mistaken it basically means your data lives longer than your program (it is persistent) so basically your program state is kept. Objects, threads, and tasks will be persistent which will keep them save from shut-downs and crashes. So developers no longer have to store data into a database or file themselves. They just create an object, which they can keep on using. When the computer is restarted the program immediatly has access to that object that was created before the computer was restarted

Theoritically you wouldn't need to save documents you type in your word-processor, since their state is kept and you can roll-back to previous versions if you'd like. This would mean the filesystem is pretty database alike.

You can compare it with PDA's. Once you start them up they immediatly start up to where you left them (because they use persistent memory that keeps the information even when the device is turned off).

I've been playing with object prevalence in java, which works about the same way. You create an object and just use it like any other object. When you restart the program you immediatly have access to that object again.

Regards,

Onno

Quote:

A few third parties have also contacted us about creating their own case designs so expect to see quite a bit of choice.

Cool... Wonder which third party companies? I think the AmigaOne-Lite should be called AmigaOne-LE (lite edition) or AmigaOne-ME (micro edition). Oh well, just a though.

Quote:

orthogonal persistence ?? What's that ?

See this link:
http://jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=020

Doesn't orthogonal persistance rely on data being constantly save to HD? Won't that short it's lifetime?

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José

"...we have to be careful not to turn AmigaOS4 into something else. POSIX, for example was created for very specific reasons, reasons that don't map one hundred percent onto the AmigaOS."

This is VERY nice to hear.
If I wanted POSIX compliance and all that I'd have switched platform for Linux or one of it's flavours for ages...Not that I don't use it though.

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José

"With hindsight, we'd have started the AmigaOS4.0 project straight away..."

This is also very nice to hear. BUt I wonder what the reason was for leaving it, and get back to it.
Ok, I'll shut up and put some questions in the next Q&A.

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José

Quote:

The voucher scheme is refundable against an AmigaOne (which is the Amiga certified Eyetech board and an OEM copy of AmigaOS that runs natively on it) so if you buy it a year after it comes out, then yes, you can claim the refund.

I hope that will help silence those who are still screaming "fraud" about the $50 coupon thing. The conditions for the refund to happen (purchasing an AmigaOne and AmigaOS 4) cannot be met yet, so there is nothing to refund yet.

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Doesn't orthogonal persistance rely on data being constantly save to HD? Won't that short it's lifetime?

Not really, and no.

Orthagonal persistance in theory and practice isn't the same. essentially it wouldn't save it all the time, what it would do is hold the current cached copy in memory where the changes to the file would be made and periodically those differences would be saved to HD. That is one way to implement a Orthagonal persistance system.
However the above still means you lose some data if the system goes down between refreshes.
Not a problem if your memory isn't volatile, in which case you'd use some form of non-volatile ram which would act as a cache for O.P. Data.
When O.P. data is being used it resides in this "cache" and is periodically written to the HD, when you finish with it, it's removed from the "cache" and written to the HD. If the system crashes in between, when it comes back up the last state the data was in will still be there in the cache and can be checked with the current copy on HD, saved to HD and/or continued editing.
You could implement an O.P. model which would save to the HD continually, but that would completely destroy the computers performance.

Quote:

It's really good to hear that the audio issue is going to be properly addressed at last. The single biggest problem for computer musicians is that of latency. A system like that which Fleecy is suggesting could really help to wipe that problem out. Add to that, the lower cooling requirements of PPC and, hopefully, drivers for quality soundcards and the platform could begin to look quite appealing for pro audio work.

As someone who uses his A1200 almost exclusively for audio work, I completely agree. Hopefully this can be addressed sooner, rather than later.

Quote:

That said, we're going to need some pretty hot software to take advantage of this - Bars&Pipes PPC would be a start......

Octamed! ahhhh............

Cheers,
Robert.
(from my shiny new A1!)

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Robert
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A1XE G4, OS4.1. Peg1 G3, MOS 1.4.
Abel Soul - Check out our tunes on Spotify

@entropy

now that makes much more sense than all that abstract read on some Java site.

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José

If only I could believe any of it!

Because it sounds like they are headed in the right direction...a solid plan, one that benefits their customers and will result in revenue for themselves.

Unfortunately, I don't believe it, and I'm not kidding.

An other nice session.. Begining to sound like a real system, eh?

Thanks Fleecy........and AmigaWorld.

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>Orthogonal Persistence

Hello
IMO the only way to reach OP is using Motorola's MRAM
(Magenetic RAM). They said that MRAM will be available in
2003, however I NEVER heard about motherboard using
MRAM, instead of the ordinary volatile DRAM.

Another leading edge technology for OP: nanotechnology
that involve "electron spin" direction for data storage.
But IMO the research will take another 10 years.

I know several old Seagate 8 Inch IPI Ramdisk for mainframe
with battery backup. If the power is cut suddenly, the Ramdisk
is stored inside a hard disk. When the power is resumed,
the hard disk data is copied to ramdisk.

There is also an old internal UPS ISA card inside PC that
can store data automatically to hard disk. I never see
a PCI version.