OK forgive me for being a bit thick here, but I assume this means that you can use Warp3D programs (quake etc) from within WinUAE?

Cheers

JS

_________________

That is correct.

However, afaicr (as far as i can read) from the webpage, it's not that good yet.

Payback is slow, Freespace don't work, Transpant surfaces don't work, and it seems quake is the only thing he got working at this point.

But, it's surely a step in the right direction

_________________

Grmblmpfh

Try it before you blame it.
Payback is slow...cause Payback is slow. I can't do anything about it, the 68k/W3D version runs with about 4 frames/second on real Amigas.
Freespace does some really weird things. This happens if the people who wrote the Api use it themselfes.

Allmost everything else, which runs fullscreen, is working. All demos from the Warp3D archive, BlitzQuake, ADescent.

Transparent surfaces _work_
There is only a problem with this special wall in the engine demo.

Just start Payback or BlitzQuake to see how advanced it is.

Quote:

Freespace does some really weird things

What do you mean with "really strange things"? I did write that code myself, and I didn't do any dirty tricks AFAIR...
If it helps you, I can have a look at the code again (Assuming you're the guy that wrote the wrapper )

Quote:

There is only a problem with this special wall in the engine demo.

I can't remember what was special about this wall, but the engine demo is crap anyway. Hey, it was written on an S3 VIRGE, goes to show how old this thing is...

Quote:

Payback is slow...cause Payback is slow. I can't do anything about it, the 68k/W3D version runs with about 4 frames/second on real Amigas.

I don't know what Amiga you are using it on but I have not had any problems with Playback. Sure software rendering on 68k (my 040@25MHz) is pants, but even PPC (603e@200MHz) runs fine, add Warp3D to it and the 040 is acceptable and the PPC is extermley playable and good fun.

As for Freespace, I can't say anything about the full version, but certainly the demo version works very well on my miggy.

_________________

@Rogue:
Yes, I'm the guy who wrote it.
It looks like Freespace writes directly into context->drawmem and IMHO that's weird
I have to allocate some mem for it and the menues stay black, so that's my current conclusion about it (although I wonder that this actually works).
I'll have to do some silly checks to see, if context->drawmem changed.

The engine demo is nice for development. Big enough to show off most Warp3D features and small enough for proper debugging.

@jumpship:
It's just the 68k/Warp3D version which is especially slow (using real Amigas or QuarkTex, draws everything using W3D_DrawTriangle ).
The PPC/Warp3D version seems OK and the 68k software version seems OK, too.
Should run nicely with a 2GHz Ahtlon though.

Quote:

Grmblmpfh Try it before you blame it.

Hey sorry, i didnt mean to bash you in anyway, i think its a very impressive achivement you have done here.

And i would never have expected a first release to be as advanced as this is. surely it is normal for this kinda thing, not to be 100% compatible.

i'll try it later, and give it a more fair and testet opinion. ok?

_________________

Quote:

i'll try it later, and give it a more fair and testet opinion. ok?

OK

> Freespace does some really weird things. This happens if the people who wrote the Api use it themselfes.

Actually, everybody can do that because the structures are documented (I know how stupid that was, but I was young and needed the money )

Quote:

It looks like Freespace writes directly into context->drawmem and IMHO that's weird

Do you mean it modifies the field in the context structure, or it writes to the memory pointed to be drawmem. The former would be wrong, the latter is legal. Calling LockHardware is as good as locking the drawing surface under DirectX.

I just looked through the sources, but it never modifies drawmem directly. It only reads from this variable.

Quote:

The engine demo is nice for development. Big enough to show off most Warp3D features and small enough for proper debugging.

Yep, that was what it was indended for. I wrote it shortly after playing System Shock (the original )

Quote:

using real Amigas or QuarkTex, draws everything using W3D_DrawTriangle

The single-primitive calls where the worst idea we ever had, to be honest

@EntilZha:
Now you'll have to wait for v0.2 until those 5 QuarkTex users will buy Freespace

@Rogue:
Mark Olsen says at ann.lu that this thingy in Engine is transparent due to a Warp3D bug.
Phew, would have been hard for me to repair this.

@Rogue & EntilZha:
Who is Hans-Joerg and who is Thomas?

Quote:

Do you mean it modifies the field in the context structure, or it writes to the memory pointed to be drawmem. The former would be wrong, the latter is legal. Calling LockHardware is as good as locking the drawing surface under DirectX.

I do not know what it's doing. I only know, WinUAE crashes if drawmem is NULL and the menues are black. So I thought it does the latter.

Quote:

I just looked through the sources, but it never modifies drawmem directly. It only reads from this variable.

Now this is really weird. So the black menu problem must be something different.
Why would it read drawmem, doing this is sooo slow using PCs.
And if the drawmem Pointer is NULL Freespace crashes just at the beginning, why does Freespace want those black pixels?

But I just have an idea about the black menues.

Quote:

The single-primitive calls where the worst idea we ever had, to be honest

The silly thing about this is, the PPC version of Payback seems to handle this differently.

Define "strange things". As far as I remember the
3D Hardware renderer of Freespace is EXTREMELY straight-forward, and asides from using a blending mode Q1 doesn't use doesn't do anything special.

Steffen

RoKo wroteQuote:

Who is Hans-Joerg and who is Thomas?

Hans-Jörg has the blue lightsaber ... and Thomas has the red one

_________________
Best regards,
hnl_dk - Henning Nielsen Lund [Denmark]

Please send no PM to me, email me if you want to contact me. See you somewhere else.

Quote:

Define "strange things". As far as I remember the 3D Hardware renderer of Freespace is EXTREMELY straight-forward, and asides from using a blending mode Q1 doesn't use doesn't do anything special.

My main concern are the menues.
The game itself is running (still with some problems though, but basically looks good).
I'm investigating right now, perhaps I can say more tomorrow.

Quote:

Poster: LaBodilsen Date: 21-Jun-2003 10:04:32 That is correct. However, afaicr (as far as i can read) from the webpage, it's not that good yet. Payback is slow, Freespace don't work, Transpant surfaces don't work, and it seems quake is the only thing he got working at this point.

Payback is slow on real amigas

I have a very nice A4000 here with 060/50 and PPC, and payback on 68K even in 320x256 was terribly slow. Adding the Warp3D support to the 68K one didnt help much. The biggest speed increase came for the PPC Warp3D combination. After that, the game became very playable in lower resolutions, and was a bit faster than the software rendered 320x256 mode when played at 640x480. People using a Voodoo3/4/5 reported better framerates than people like me on a CV too.

Also the transparent surfaces do work - just look in quake to see that It was just that "featurette" of the Engine demo that wasn't working properly.

All in all, Robert did a fantastic job in bringing the Warp3D API to WinUAE, and its nice to see all the coders involved in that, and with Warp3D working together

Do remember though that only 68K Warp3D applications are going to work on this - no PPC ones, so games like Heretic2, Wipeout 2097 etc which do not have a 68K version made will not run using QuarkTex.

_________________
Test sig (new)

@RoKo

> Mark Olsen says at ann.lu that this thingy in Engine is transparent due to a Warp3D bug.

Yeah, he should know.. definitely...

Quote:

says at ann.lu

I wouldn't belive anything that you read on ANN.lu.

@Rogue & EntilZha:
Don't judge it before you read it, you're too rude.
He wrote:
"The program uses W3D_SRC_ALPHA, W3D_ZERO as blendmode, which can't give transparency. If you hack the program to run in other screendepths than 15, you can verify that the window is not even transparent with Warp3D using a Voodoo3".
This shouldn't be transparent, I'll check if Engine really does this. But I don't know, why he should write something wrong about this.

I didn't want to offend you by writing "there is a bug in Warp3D".
And I don't want to get "zwischen die Fronten".
I'm thankfull for everybody who helps me, doesn't matter who he is.

Quote:

Don't judge it before you read it, you're too rude

I didn't read it because I never read ANN. If you've been there for some time, you will probably know why...