If there is one tacktic i see here again and again it is
the one of breaking down other peoples work and
then ask them to join your master work.

That will not work, if you can not work together forgett
it all and go your own way and leave eachother alone.

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A1G3-SE + OS4.1 u1 iso (x2)

@gary_c

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didn't Amiga, Inc. impose a condition that the machine could not be sold with OSs other than AmigaOS installed?

IIRC the condition was that all machines come with OS4 installed, in order to prevent someone from buying a machine without OS4 and running a pirate copy of OS4 on it. That made sense for the A1, which was going to come in a Linux version and an OS4 (dongled) version. The idea was that no-one could buy the OS4 version of the board without OS4. Obviously that can't apply to a generic board like the Pegasos.

@gary_c

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Quote: - do you want AOS4? I'm not bbrv of course, but this is my opinion (and I hope the bbrv reply is in those questions we submitted a while ago). My impression is that any OS/user base still active with PPC is an asset for the architecture overall. Genesi is, after all, a PowerPC hardware/firmware provider and, let's face it, the platform has seen brighter days. In this context, it makes sense to get even rather small subsets like PPC Amiga on board for possible collective benefit. Part of the benefit would be more enthusiasm and perception of activity for the Power/PowerPC platform. Part might be actual increased sales for Genesi from this market, but I think that's secondary.

Here you list some reasons why AOS4 would be good for the PPC-oriented efforts of Mr. Buck (and why he would want AOS4)...

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I suspect there is also something personal about bbrv's quest related to AmigaOS. Personally, I can't see how it would be worth the effort. Like Seehund said, I really hope this is something bbrv are doing in their spare time after the real business has been done.

... and here you say that AOS4 is not worth the effort.
It speaks by itself.

And, BTW, as for the spare time thingie: I had already answered to SeeHund, but you repeated what he had said without adding anything and without paying attention to my answer - again, it speaks by itself.

Quote:

When I see the reactions to bbrv's posts here, though, I have to wonder what the net gain would be for power.org anyway.

If there had been no gain, BB would be, to say the least, a very bad business man, as he'd be investing a lot on something useless.
Otherwise, there must be a potential gain. And there is. Besides what you have mentioned yourself, there is The Name (yes, The Name: it's not as worthless as the naysayers like to say... the world outside this tiny community knows nothing about the tragic/ridiculous/etc. situations the Amiga has been through, so the value has remained intact) and AOS4 itself (it makes a commercial and technical difference when on your platform(s) you have an official - and promising - version of a famous OS running, especially when the other OSes are already spread, work better, offer/enjoy more support and are more convenient on other platforms (Linux & whatever else) or are (semi-)unknown, in a very delicate situation and find in AOS4 itself a terrible rival (MorphOS).

Quote:

Quote: - have you ever tried / are you trying to get the license (in a fully professional and legal way, I mean)? IIRC, there was negotiating way back in the early days, but didn't Amiga, Inc. impose a condition that the machine could not be sold with OSs other than AmigaOS installed? Please correct me if I'm wrong about that, anyone.

Could be. I can't remember and personally I don't care about the details. Facts say that BB did not get a license.
(continued below)

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Anyway, in 2006, the concept of a hardware maker paying the OS provider for the right to provide essential hardware so that the OS can be sold and used seems totally wrong to me. Of course the value of anything depends on the context, so if AmigaOS would drive Genesi ODW sales in a great way, it might be worth it to Genesi to pay a premium for this, knowing they would quickly recover that cost. But realistically, this is not the situation for AOS4. Personally, I think it makes sense for the OS vendor to get income from the unit sales, but nothing additional. So the license would just be a kind of cooperation agreement, with no money changing hands. -- gary_c

First Pixie, then SeeHund, now you: you all tried to steer the discussion in this direction.
Bad or good, pretty or ugly, like it or not, there *are* rules. Rules that AInc, being the owner of AOS, has any right to make as it pleases. If somebody does not like them, then the only way to try to change them is getting privately and professionally in touch with AInc and proposing them a valid alternative. For sure, exploiting the weaknesses of the community, of the market, of Hyperion, you name it, the way BB has been doing over and over again is not the right way and is unacceptable. This, along with personal insults, sly lawsuits, open attacks and whatever has been publically witnessed in these last years (and even before... I've heard negative comments about BB since the VisCorp times), rules BB out as a reliable business partner. No wonder if AInc refused to partner with him. They can't be blamed even if BB had commercially valid proposals. BB is only reaping what he sowed - and he keeps on sowing bad seeds.

saimo

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RETREAM - retro dreams for Amiga, Commodore 64 and PC

@gary_c

Quote:

IIRC, there was negotiating way back in the early days, but didn't Amiga, Inc. impose a condition that the machine could not be sold with OSs other than AmigaOS installed? Please correct me if I'm wrong about that, anyone.

Only sort of, I think thats one of the most misunderstood parts of the licencing scheme, what they said was that any machine capable of running OS4 had to be sold with a licence for it, what they meant was (they were originally talking of a "security chip" but settled I believe on a "key" or some such in the firmware) that you could sell (ie an efika if it had an OS4 licence) without Os4 for Linux/Morphos etc but there had to be something in the design (ie in the firmware) that you could have a check in OS4 that would stop it running on non-legit machines (ie you buy OS4 you get an update to your firmware that enables it or register it with your ethernet hardware address etc etc).

Regards

Mark

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IceStar Media Ltd.